"Lack of MACs guns" Given that Reach was the damn center of the UNSC and ONI, Halo Reach should at least have had a whole battalion of UNSC Frigates, Destroyers and Carriers. And what about the two Capital Ships that where supposed to be at bay with the North Polar Station - the Leviathan; And South Polar Station -I forgot the name of the other capital ship-? Bungie sucked big time in creating 'conflict' and 'resolution' during the WHOLE game of Reach.

Every fictional universe has its errors and contradictions. Look at the Star Trek and Star Wars universes. The same problems are in other universes.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Fatal Factor "Reach was invaded July 24 fool!" Yes it was, but it wasnt the same invasion fleet described in TFoR, it was the LNOS fleet (which by the way is a large enough ship to hold its entire fleet INSIDE itself). People have complained about how the fleet of particular justice steamrolled reach in 2 hours when reach was suppose to be our fortress world. Why do you think that is? Because there were two seperate invasion waves beforehand which softened it up for the fleet of particular justice to deliver the final hammerblow. Its called warfare. "There should be no s-IIIs running around they all died in suicide ops, idiot!" The best and brightest spartan IIIs were pulled from those ops for a greater purpose, i dont know how many times this has been stated, just go and read headhunters or something. "ONI didnt respect the cole protocol with the Circumference, this is an outrage" Since when have ONI operated under the law? lol. "Noble teams ages dun maek no sense!" Cryo sleep. Also the best you can tell from their ingame appearances is that they are all in their early to mid 20s "where are those damn ODPs!" Probably getting annihilated by covie ground forces. Also, read ONI data drop four. (quick preview: Reach was intentionally sacrificed by ONI.....for the greater good) "POA not rated for atmosphere! OMG!" No it is not. Which is why you see those HUGE BRIGHT YELLOW disposable boosters it needed just to take off from reach and which it presumably needed to get down in one piece too. You can see the results of an unassisted atmospheric landing attempt on alpha halo, when keys takes her down and manages to gouge a mile long trench in the ground and nearly tips her over a cliff. Final note, as stated the MAC shot seen at the end of sword base is not an SMAC, it is a shot from a frigate or cruiser. Ships include "orbital defence" too. Even a frigate had to get special authorisation to fire a MAC in atmosphere due to the dangers, theres no way the UNSC would have turned an SMAC around and shot themselves with it, come on people. Not aimed at anyone in particular, just trying really hard to dispell canon myths that wont go away.[/quote] ^ This

It would seem that the data drops at least cover the invasion date issue.

"Reach was invaded July 24 fool!" Yes it was, but it wasnt the same invasion fleet described in TFoR, it was the LNOS fleet (which by the way is a large enough ship to hold its entire fleet INSIDE itself). People have complained about how the fleet of particular justice steamrolled reach in 2 hours when reach was suppose to be our fortress world. Why do you think that is? Because there were two seperate invasion waves beforehand which softened it up for the fleet of particular justice to deliver the final hammerblow. Its called warfare. "There should be no s-IIIs running around they all died in suicide ops, idiot!" The best and brightest spartan IIIs were pulled from those ops for a greater purpose, i dont know how many times this has been stated, just go and read headhunters or something. "ONI didnt respect the cole protocol with the Circumference, this is an outrage" Since when have ONI operated under the law? lol. "Noble teams ages dun maek no sense!" Cryo sleep. Also the best you can tell from their ingame appearances is that they are all in their early to mid 20s "where are those damn ODPs!" Probably getting annihilated by covie ground forces. Also, read ONI data drop four. (quick preview: Reach was intentionally sacrificed by ONI.....for the greater good) "POA not rated for atmosphere! OMG!" No it is not. Which is why you see those HUGE BRIGHT YELLOW disposable boosters it needed just to take off from reach and which it presumably needed to get down in one piece too. You can see the results of an unassisted atmospheric landing attempt on alpha halo, when keys takes her down and manages to gouge a mile long trench in the ground and nearly tips her over a cliff. Final note, as stated the MAC shot seen at the end of sword base is not an SMAC, it is a shot from a frigate or cruiser. Ships include "orbital defence" too. Even a frigate had to get special authorisation to fire a MAC in atmosphere due to the dangers, theres no way the UNSC would have turned an SMAC around and shot themselves with it, come on people. Not aimed at anyone in particular, just trying really hard to dispell canon myths that wont go away.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] grey101 no matter how coma trys to defend it the PoA will always be an issue. It was heavily damaged after fighting thus for it to land in the middle of a volcanic area of covenant activity is just blasphemy. There is absolutly no way the the PoA would have been able to return let alone leave the planet with the covenant having control of the orbital space. on top of that the PoA would have a far more difficult time with entering and leaving the planet in its condition seeing how only a skeleton of the ship was left by that time. How would keyes land on reach then not remember doing so? "retcon" or not, the original "The flood" clearly stated the ship was too heavy to work in atmosphere and that it wasn't made to do so. along with the fact keyes was iffy about a crash landing not a standard one.[/quote] And what makes you think that the Covenant were in full and firm control of Reach at the same time as in TFoR? I'm not so sure that would be the case now since the battle has been extended to two weeks and there would be a far larger fleet of UNSC ships present during the battle and they would have had a far longer time to prepare their defenses. Even in the book the UNSC was still fighting strongly when the [i]Autumn[/i] fled. And how is it landing with heavy damage such a problem? It crash landed on Halo just fine. And actually the dialogue in the game would indicate that it wasn't a hotbed of Covenant activity yet, Dot says that Covenant forces are hastening to the site, it doesn't really sound much like a hotbed of activity. So what? The Flood is from around the same time as TFoR when the 'verse was still being developed, an off-hand remark/thought that does not have any true significance to the overall story of the Haloverse is not something to place such heavy stock in. It makes just about as much amount of difference as when the various species of the Covenant were encountered. Why make such a big deal about it if it's changed? The [i]Autumn[/i] is still too heavy to get itself off the ground on its own or fly around freely like a Covenant ship or UNSC frigate.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] privet caboose [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] NinStarRune [quote] Error: Lack of Orbital MAC's. Proof: Reach had a number of Orbital MAC's that were used in the battle of Reach. They were present on August 30th, so they should have been present during the mission "Long Night of Solace" in Halo: Reach. Had they been present, they Jorge wouldn't have died. Where were they? Source: Fall of Reach, First Strike, Halo: Reach [/quote] End of ONI: Sword Base. YOUR ARGUMENT IS INVALID.[/quote] Far too weak to be from a SMAC. We agreed long ago that Reach had an orbital defense grid that consisted of regular MAC's, and then the Super MAC's we're familiar with. [/quote] I disagree with that. The SMAC's were shot down in the books so they most likely have been shot down before Noble Team discovered that the Covenant was invading Earth.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] NinStarRune [quote] Error: Lack of Orbital MAC's. Proof: Reach had a number of Orbital MAC's that were used in the battle of Reach. They were present on August 30th, so they should have been present during the mission "Long Night of Solace" in Halo: Reach. Had they been present, they Jorge wouldn't have died. Where were they? Source: Fall of Reach, First Strike, Halo: Reach [/quote] End of ONI: Sword Base. YOUR ARGUMENT IS INVALID.[/quote] Far too weak to be from a SMAC. We agreed long ago that Reach had an orbital defense grid that consisted of regular MAC's, and then the Super MAC's we're familiar with.

[quote] Error: Lack of Orbital MAC's. Proof: Reach had a number of Orbital MAC's that were used in the battle of Reach. They were present on August 30th, so they should have been present during the mission "Long Night of Solace" in Halo: Reach. Had they been present, they Jorge wouldn't have died. Where were they? Source: Fall of Reach, First Strike, Halo: Reach [/quote] End of ONI: Sword Base. YOUR ARGUMENT IS INVALID.

Bungie is the Creaters of the Halo Universe itself, and afterwards an author was approached to write a Halo novelization.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SickBoy254698 I was just wondering who actually created the Halo Universe? Cause I could have sworn it was the guys at Bungie not the author of books about a world Bungie created. I understand where you guys are coming from because the books were released in conjunction with the games to provide extra info. As a result the books carried a lot of weight especially when it came to filling in the blanks of the Halo Universe left behind by the games. What you guys don't seem to get is the guy who wrote them was never a Bungie employee. When he wrote The Fall of Reach his job at Microsoft was re-writing Encarta, there online encyclopedia. He also wrote the book in just 7 weeks. Seven weeks is plenty of time to write a book sure. But I imagine Bungie had little, if any, opportunity to go over the details before it was published. Microsoft was doing what businesses do. Making money of a great product. Since the guys at Bungie were under financial constraints when they signed the contract with MS they probably had no say on any of this. So 10 years later they decide to tell the story of how war in the Universe they created began. What exactly is wrong with that? [/quote] You seem to think that the novels were all written by Nylund, and that isn't the case. Joe Staten, the man who literally created Halo's story(For CE-ODST) wrote one of the novels(Contact Harvest) So yes, a Bungie Employee did infact write a novel. Also, Bungie said time and time again that for better or worse, the novels ARE canon. And Frankie has now stated that both the Books AND the Games are on the same level of canon. "It's all just the same canon" there is no longer a hierarchy.

Yay errors fixed!

no matter how coma trys to defend it the PoA will always be an issue. It was heavily damaged after fighting thus for it to land in the middle of a volcanic area of covenant activity is just blasphemy. There is absolutly no way the the PoA would have been able to return let alone leave the planet with the covenant having control of the orbital space. on top of that the PoA would have a far more difficult time with entering and leaving the planet in its condition seeing how only a skeleton of the ship was left by that time. How would keyes land on reach then not remember doing so? "retcon" or not, the original "The flood" clearly stated the ship was too heavy to work in atmosphere and that it wasn't made to do so. along with the fact keyes was iffy about a crash landing not a standard one.

It's called a retcon, comics do it all the time.

I was just wondering who actually created the Halo Universe? Cause I could have sworn it was the guys at Bungie not the author of books about a world Bungie created. I understand where you guys are coming from because the books were released in conjunction with the games to provide extra info. As a result the books carried a lot of weight especially when it came to filling in the blanks of the Halo Universe left behind by the games. What you guys don't seem to get is the guy who wrote them was never a Bungie employee. When he wrote The Fall of Reach his job at Microsoft was re-writing Encarta, there online encyclopedia. He also wrote the book in just 7 weeks. Seven weeks is plenty of time to write a book sure. But I imagine Bungie had little, if any, opportunity to go over the details before it was published. Microsoft was doing what businesses do. Making money of a great product. Since the guys at Bungie were under financial constraints when they signed the contract with MS they probably had no say on any of this. So 10 years later they decide to tell the story of how war in the Universe they created began. What exactly is wrong with that?

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] KoO 101 I suppose if the battle was changed, that makes it different. I kind-of liked the way Nylund had described it, though. I can understand why you wouldn't, but I did. I mean, in the cutscene after The Long Night of Solace, they show hundreds of Covenant ships arriving. Presumably, that's when the battle that is described in TFoR starts but then still so much time elapses before TPoA leaves. The Covenant severely outnumbered the UNSC and really should have been able to overrun the space defenses that quickly IMO.[/quote] That's one of the things I did like about TFoR, his skills at describing things and making you feel almost like you're there are quite good, I was just a little less than enthusiastic about how he depicted the events of the battle. The way he described them was really good though. Actually there are two seperate fleets that attack Reach (three if you count the LNoS and its complimentary Corvettes as a fleet), the first proper fleet is the one that arrives on the 14th just after you destroy the LNoS. The Fleet of Particular Justice (the Arbiter's fleet from TFoR) still arrives on the 30th and that's what finally kills Reach and crushes all the defenses. Eh, in TFoR I really think they were pretty evenly matched, especially since the UNSC killed practically a third of the Covenant fleet before the battle even really began while their losses at that stage were fairly minimal. That brought their ship numbers to just about the same numbers, and then factor in the SMACs, brilliant military minds and tacticians like Keyes, and the Covenant should have really had their work cut out for them. They would have eventually won, I'm sure, but it would have been a really, really Pyrrhic victory, much more so than it was already in the book. [quote]I got the feeling that they were. At least after they got the data. The Banshees chasing their pelican, the scarabs trying to stop them, drop pods coming in, Phantoms passing overhead, all the troops at the landing and then the Zealots that get dropped in and all the Phantoms and Banshees you have to shoot down. And in that time they only sent one ship in orbit to try to stop the Autumn? It just seems a little too convenient to me.[/quote] *shrug* It seemed to me like they just ran into a large amount of bad luck getting to the [i]Autumn[/i]. It actually makes sense that they would run into quite a few Covenant squads and such on their way there, as Dot did mention that the Ship Breaking Yards in Aszod was one of the last secure extraction sites on Reach. So it'd make sense for the Covenant to be making their way there in full force. I think that ship was probably one of the lucky ones, being able to break through the battle and get down to the planet, or it may have already been there since a Covenant fleet did arrive on the 14th. In any case, I'm sure it was just sent there to secure Aszod for the Covenant and prevent any UNSC there from escaping Reach. And then the Banshees and Phantoms at the end were trying to destroy the Onager or knock Six out of it to help secure the area. It was the strongest piece of defensive machinery (aside from the [i]Autumn[/i] and its guns) the UNSC had there.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] privet caboose Here is a compilation of errors that we, the universe elite, have created in light of Halo: Reach's launch. Note, that this is STILL a work in progress, and will be upgraded as new breaks are located. [quote][/quote] [b]Error:[/b] Reach was invaded on July 24th. [b]Proof:[/b] All Halo media has always stated Reach fell in one day, and that day was August 30th. [b]Sources:[/b]Ghosts of Oynx, First Strike, Fall of Reach. [quote][/quote] [b]Error:[/b] Alpha Company was wiped out completely during Operation: PROMETHEUS in 2537. Carter, Emile, and Jun should not be alive. [b]Proof:[/b] Halo: Ghosts of Onyx goes into quite a bit of detail on Operation: PROMETHEUS. Spartan-III Alpha Company (comprised of 300 Spartans) were sent to K7-49 on a mission to destroy plasma reactors the Covenant were using to liquefy metallurgical components. The operation was a success, but it is explicitly stated that it cost the lives of [i]every Spartan-III on the asteroid[/i] because they got cut off from their Calypso-class Exfiltration crafts and completely lost their unit cohesion. Halo Reach chooses to ignore this. Carter (A-259), Emile (A-239), and Jun (A-266) are a part of Noble Team when they should have been dead years ago; Bungie have given us no explanation on [i]how[/i] they escaped at all. [b]Sources: [/b] - Ghosts of Onyx, page 83-87. - Halo Reach [quote][/quote] [b]Error:[/b] ONI's actions as well as the Cole Protocol. According to the Cole Protocol, if any Covenant Forces are detected, then all NAV bases and ships should purge their computers of information to protect Earth and the inner colonies. [b]Proof:[/b]If Covenant are detected on Reach on July 23rd, how is it that a month later, there are still computers with information to Earth still active? If ONI hadn't taken more than a month, than Blue team wouldn't have been deployed to the Circumference, and James wouldn't have died, and Linda wouldn't have been in a coma. Infact, they would have been on Reach with Red team. Sources: Pg 289 of The Fall of Reach gives information on the purging of Info not complete. [url]http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/United_Nations_Space_Command_Emerg ency_Priority_Order_098831A-1[/url] [quote][/quote] [b]Error:[/B] Carter, Emile, and Jun's age. Carter is born in 2520. He was 11 years old when Alpha Company began their training. This puts him 5 years above the previously stated age, and it makes no sense at all. Why would they have an 11 year old on the same training regime as a 4 year old? It's too large of a difference, and it's an error that can be avoiding by simply changing his birthdate. This same thing goes for Emile and Jun, who are older than 6 years old at Alpha training. [b]Proof:[/b] Page 69(I'm doing this by memory, I may be wrong.) of Ghosts of Oynx states that all of Alpha Company was comprised of 4, 5, and 6 year old children that he was going to have to forge into the best warriors humanity has ever seen. [b]Source:[/b] Ghosts of Oynx, page 69. [quote][/quote] [b]Error:[/b] Lack of Orbital MAC's. [b]Proof:[/b] Reach had a number of Orbital MAC's that were used in the battle of Reach. They were present on August 30th, so they should have been present during the mission "Long Night of Solace" in Halo: Reach. Had they been present, they Jorge wouldn't have died. Where were they? [B]Source:[/b] Fall of Reach, First Strike, Halo: Reach [quote][/quote] [b]Error:[/b] Pillar of Autumn on Reach. [b]Proof[/b] During the final level of Halo: Reach, the Pillar of Autumn is on the planet, and isn't in space, preparing for the Prophet mission. This COMPLETELY destroys much of Halo's canon. If the ship wasn't in space, than the Spartans of Red Team would have never jumped to the planet, meaning that the 4 spartans who died, would have still been alive. Which could have hanged the outcome of the battle. PLUS, the space op to destroy the Circumference's NAV data wouldn't have happened. So Chief, James, and Linda had no reason to NOT be part of Red team. So the chief wouldn't have been on the Autumn, so Halo: CE wouldn't have happened. Why schedule a mission to capture a prophet, when there's a full scale invasion of Humanities second most important planet? [b]Sources:[/b] Halo: Reach, Fall of Reach [u]Special Thanks:[/u] -ajw23207 -MOB74656 -xXFatal v1 -opog -Kippa If I've missed any errors, please, point them out. I'll add them to the OP, or try to explain them. Also, if you have any explanation to these canon errors, please, explain how they fit into canon, and the sources. [/quote] I have to say that what happens in the game is true and what happens in the novels is not because Bungie is the creator of halo and they made the game the way they saw it, so their story is the true one and not the books.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] OrderedComa I think certain aspects of the battle would probably be either outright changed or subtly different now because of the addition of Reach.[/quote] I suppose if the battle was changed, that makes it different. I kind-of liked the way Nylund had described it, though. I can understand why you wouldn't, but I did. I mean, in the cutscene after The Long Night of Solace, they show hundreds of Covenant ships arriving. Presumably, that's when the battle that is described in TFoR starts but then still so much time elapses before TPoA leaves. The Covenant severely outnumbered the UNSC and really should have been able to overrun the space defenses that quickly IMO. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] OrderedComa Why would they have been following Noble? I never go that impression at all from the game, so I'm a little confused by this idea.[/quote] I got the feeling that they were. At least after they got the data. The Banshees chasing their pelican, the scarabs trying to stop them, drop pods coming in, Phantoms passing overhead, all the troops at the landing and then the Zealots that get dropped in and all the Phantoms and Banshees you have to shoot down. And in that time they only sent one ship in orbit to try to stop the Autumn? It just seems a little too convenient to me.

Bungie stated in a BWU that Halo reachs campaign Would NOT follow the books...just sayin....

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] KoO 101 I don't see how a Pelican trying to land with Banshees and Seraphs shooting it down is any different from TPoA with a Covenant armada shooting it down. My point was more, how does the TPoA go from being in a space battle to just running away to land on Reach? The Covenant has already started glassing the planet but they don't see TPoA as a threat when they should have tracked it running from the fight after destroying a bunch of their ships? I don't know, I just don't buy it. The Covenant should have had complete control of the space around Reach by this point and have destroyed TPoA from orbit. Especially if they've been following Noble to get that data.[/quote] I think certain aspects of the battle would probably be either outright changed or subtly different now because of the addition of Reach. Like it probably was not such a complete curbstomp battle like it was originally in TFoR. I don't think the Covenant would be able to fight through the defenses so easily. Especially adding in the fact that with Reach there would now be a whole lot more than just around 150 UNSC ships present. Why would they have been following Noble? I never go that impression at all from the game, so I'm a little confused by this idea. [quote]I admit, I forgot about the point defense guns to defend against Banshees and Seraphs, but my point was more that their larger ships should have destroyed it from orbit as I was saying above. I doubt that TPoA can just leave a space battle and land on Reach without any Covenant ever detecting it.[/quote] See above point(s). Even from the standpoint of the book the battle should have lasted much longer than it did, nowhere near as long as in the game, but it still should have lasted longer than a paltry two hours. Probably a full day at the least. I really wasn't ever awed by the depiction of the Battle of Reach in TFoR, it felt too rushed to do it justice and almost an asspull, imo :/ It kind of felt like Nylund wasn't even really trying. One of the things that put me off about the depiction in the book was the fact that 75+ UNSC ships just disappeared with absolutely no explanation or reason whatsoever. Like one paragraph they're there, and then the next they're just suddenly gone, and not from any Covenant attack or anything, they're just...gone. And the ground battle was even more ludicrous, there is no way in hell that the Covenant would be able to completely overrun the generator complex and Reach's High Command in under an hour. [quote]This is a tired argument that I don't take part in. I just added that in there for effect. I can see both sides of this argument and for the sake of canon, I can overlook it.[/quote] Same here, it's one of those things that I really just can't be bothered to care about. It got onto the planet, and it didn't just fly off on its own power, so yeah *shrug* And not to mention that "not rated for atmosphere" is never really defined all that clearly and the [i]Spirit of Fire[/i] (which is much, much, much larger than the [i]Autumn[/i]) is floating all by itself in the atmosphere of the Shield World in Halo Wars.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] OrderedComa Pelicans are far more vulnerable to hostile fire than, and Red Team had gotten shot down on their way to the planet. I think it would be rather obvious that Pelican transport wasn't going to really work. Either coming or going it would be shot down, heck even traveling in a lone Pelican on the planet wasn't that safe, look what happened to Noble on their way to Aszod. [/quote] I don't see how a Pelican trying to land with Banshees and Seraphs shooting it down is any different from TPoA with a Covenant armada shooting it down. My point was more, how does the TPoA go from being in a space battle to just running away to land on Reach? The Covenant has already started glassing the planet but they don't see TPoA as a threat when they should have tracked it running from the fight after destroying a bunch of their ships? I don't know, I just don't buy it. The Covenant should have had complete control of the space around Reach by this point and have destroyed TPoA from orbit. Especially if they've been following Noble to get that data. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] OrderedComa And the [i]Autumn[/i] wouldn't be defenseless on the ground, it would be much like sitting in a base, granted it wouldn't be entirely safe from larger Covenant ships like cruisers and such, but the UNSC was still strong enough in numbers and defenses to keep Covenant capitol ships away from Aszod until right around when Noble got there. The PoA would most definitely be completely safe from the likes of Banshees and Covenant dropships, it has point defense guns on it remember?[/quote] I admit, I forgot about the point defense guns to defend against Banshees and Seraphs, but my point was more that their larger ships should have destroyed it from orbit as I was saying above. I doubt that TPoA can just leave a space battle and land on Reach without any Covenant ever detecting it. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] OrderedComa As for whether it can enter an atmosphere, Halo: Combat Evolved says hi. ;P[/quote] This is a tired argument that I don't take part in. I just added that in there for effect. I can see both sides of this argument and for the sake of canon, I can overlook it.

[url=http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/2/markey_mark_wtf.gif]Reads thread[/url] [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] OrderedComa [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] KoO 101 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] OrderedComa I see no problems with the [i]Autumn[/i] landing at some point between those time. [/quote] Why would the Autumn land, though? There's no reason for it to except for maybe to escape the space battle to retrieve the data. But, really, landing would make the Autumn defenseless and it would have to exit atmosphere before jumping to slipspace which makes no sense to do. Why not just fly Pelicans in from space like they always do? It's not even a big thing because everything would have still played out the same way, but it just seems sloppy that Bungie would have rather been able to show TPoA taking off than respect TFoR's canon that TPoA was in space not that long ago and then enters atmosphere, equips the thrusters to break atmosphere just to retrieve some data and then exits atmosphere again. All that assuming that TPoA can even enter atmosphere. [/quote] Pelicans are far more vulnerable to hostile fire than, and Red Team had gotten shot down on their way to the planet. I think it would be rather obvious that Pelican transport wasn't going to really work. Either coming or going it would be shot down, heck even traveling in a lone Pelican on the planet wasn't that safe, look what happened to Noble on their way to Aszod. And the [i]Autumn[/i] wouldn't be defenseless on the ground, it would be much like sitting in a base, granted it wouldn't be entirely safe from larger Covenant ships like cruisers and such, but the UNSC was still strong enough in numbers and defenses to keep Covenant capitol ships away from Aszod until right around when Noble got there. The PoA would most definitely be completely safe from the likes of Banshees and Covenant dropships, it has point defense guns on it remember? As for whether it can enter an atmosphere, Halo: Combat Evolved says hi. ;P[/quote]

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] KoO 101 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] OrderedComa I see no problems with the [i]Autumn[/i] landing at some point between those time. [/quote] Why would the Autumn land, though? There's no reason for it to except for maybe to escape the space battle to retrieve the data. But, really, landing would make the Autumn defenseless and it would have to exit atmosphere before jumping to slipspace which makes no sense to do. Why not just fly Pelicans in from space like they always do? It's not even a big thing because everything would have still played out the same way, but it just seems sloppy that Bungie would have rather been able to show TPoA taking off than respect TFoR's canon that TPoA was in space not that long ago and then enters atmosphere, equips the thrusters to break atmosphere just to retrieve some data and then exits atmosphere again. All that assuming that TPoA can even enter atmosphere. [/quote] Pelicans are far more vulnerable to hostile fire than, and Red Team had gotten shot down on their way to the planet. I think it would be rather obvious that Pelican transport wasn't going to really work. Either coming or going it would be shot down, heck even traveling in a lone Pelican on the planet wasn't that safe, look what happened to Noble on their way to Aszod. And the [i]Autumn[/i] wouldn't be defenseless on the ground, it would be much like sitting in a base, granted it wouldn't be entirely safe from larger Covenant ships like cruisers and such, but the UNSC was still strong enough in numbers and defenses to keep Covenant capitol ships away from Aszod until right around when Noble got there. The PoA would most definitely be completely safe from the likes of Banshees and Covenant dropships, it has point defense guns on it remember? As for whether it can enter an atmosphere, Halo: Combat Evolved says hi. ;P

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] OrderedComa I see no problems with the [i]Autumn[/i] landing at some point between those time. [/quote] Why would the Autumn land, though? There's no reason for it to except for maybe to escape the space battle to retrieve the data. But, really, landing would make the Autumn defenseless and it would have to exit atmosphere before jumping to slipspace which makes no sense to do. Why not just fly Pelicans in from space like they always do? It's not even a big thing because everything would have still played out the same way, but it just seems sloppy that Bungie would have rather been able to show TPoA taking off than respect TFoR's canon that TPoA was in space not that long ago and then enters atmosphere, equips the thrusters to break atmosphere just to retrieve some data and then exits atmosphere again. All that assuming that TPoA can even enter atmosphere.

[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spartan1065 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] OrderedComa Error #6: Pillar of Autumn on Reach. The only way people can even argue this as an error is with the "not rated for atmosphere" argument, which is not really an effective argument.[/quote]Are you serious? The Autumn was not even supposed to be on Reach at all. The argument has been made a thousand times over and Caboose does a fine job of stating it in the OP so I'm just going to quote him. [quote]This COMPLETELY destroys much of Halo's canon. If the ship wasn't in space, than the Spartans of Red Team would have never jumped to the planet, meaning that the 4 spartans who died, would have still been alive. Which could have hanged the outcome of the battle. PLUS, the space op to destroy the Circumference's NAV data wouldn't have happened. So Chief, James, and Linda had no reason to NOT be part of Red team. So the chief wouldn't have been on the Autumn, so Halo: CE wouldn't have happened. Why schedule a mission to capture a prophet, when there's a full scale invasion of Humanities second most important planet? [/quote]As he says it completely ruins the storyline of the novel.[/quote] -.- Caboose's so called "arguments" on this particular point are laughable at best. Nothing at all in the game said, or indicated in the slightest, that the [i]Autumn[/i] had been sitting in Aszod for the whole game. Making claims like that with absolutely no supporting evidence to back it up just doesn't work. You can't make broad assumptions like what Caboose did in the OP and expect people to believe it when you have no evidence to support it. Look at the time stamp on the last level, the time given is 16:32 (4:30 PM when translated into normal time as opposed to military) which is long [i]after[/i] the [i]Autumn[/i] has done its part in the space battle, picked up John and the survivors of Gamma Station, and dropped off Red Team, all of those things took place from about 6:00-6:45 AM. I see no problems with the [i]Autumn[/i] landing at some point between those time. The only thing having that changes with the PoA being on Reach is their departure time for Alpha Halo, and that is change that matters about as much as when each Covenant species was first encountered in the war. I see no ruining of TFoR's story here.

Errors in halo? whod'a thunkit