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10/28/2016 6:18:12 PM
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Solution: Remove the radar in the competitive scene. There has never been a successful competitive FPS with radar. Halo is the best example of a successful competitive FPS without radar until Halo 5 where the competitive scene for the most part died and the player base massively dropped due to the radar and other pointless game mechanics. This game is more like Halo than most people can probably imagine, once you take out the radar that is. What I have found by playing countless hours of inferno and playing with FizZoR (Twitch streamer) is that to win inferno you have to control the stronger side of the map which happens to be A flag spawn on every map due to Bungie's design. This is because the angles are more favorable on A side even on symmetrical maps which are still slightly different on each side. Shotguns are ineffective without the radar because shotgun players have to get close to you to deal enough damage. But with a good team and a A flag setup on inferno it is hard for shotgun players to get close to you before getting burst down by primaries. If you don't believe me and think I am talking a bunch of nonsense then watch this video:
Explaining why shotguns are ineffective with radar and how A flag is better: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j3DQdAJaV4Y
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Wait hold on are you saying that shotguns are BETTER with radar? Losing radar literally takes out their one current disadvantage.
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I would highly disagree with you I carried my team to 9-0 at 363 light with a broken thumb while using a sniper rifle. It isn't hard to punish shotgun players with good communication and teamwork.
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But what I'm saying is that that's not unique to no radar. You can work well as a team with radar on. What's the thing that's different with no radar that makes it harder for a shotgunner?
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The fact that he can't see exactly where you are at all times and brainlessly rush you. If you hold a A flag setup on no radar then the rushing shotgun player will easy be spotted before he gets near you and be forced to switch to his primary which by that time you would have communicated where the shotgun player is and team shot him. When you are waiting for the shotgun player but he doesn't know you are there you have a advantage.
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like halo? wut unbalanced weapons vs everyone using the same weapon slower movement speed slower time to kill more of a focus on gun skill rather than getting that one shot kill everyone has a one hit kill weapon at the ready at all times compared to there being no more than 2 or 3 one hit kill weapons for both teams?
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Most competitive game type of Destiny? 4v4. Most competitive game type of Halo? 4v4. How to win a game of Halo? Control the power weapons (by having map control) to defeat the enemy team. How to win a game of Destiny? Control the map and the pace of the game to defeat the enemy team. TTK, movement speed, balance and weapons are different but the core of the game is still there I could continue my list of what makes these two [u]BUNGIE[/u] games similar but that would take forever. Bungie created a game quite similar to Halo at the core but most people don't see it.
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Halo and The Crucible are more different than they are similar. 'The fact that people expect them to be the same...and want to treat them the same...is the reason why we are 2.5 years into this game and STILL don't have a balanced weapon system. Because the comparisons to Halo has Bungie going about trying to balance them in a way that will never work.
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Weapon balancing has nothing to do with making Destiny more like Halo. The main reasons these balancing changes have happened is because people got tired of two weapons making up the whole meta. Considering how many weapon types we have I doubt there will ever be a point in Destiny 1 where everyone agrees that we have balance. People will always complain about weapon balance.
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You've got that backwards...and you need to listen to four hours of interviews that Weisznewski and Sage Merrill gave to Planet Destiny on this subject. The long primary weapon TTK in this game is a DELIBERATE CHOICE on the part of the Sandbox team in an effort to recreate the dynamics of Halo's MP. So that play is team oriented (team shooting) rather than mainly 1v1 engagements. Even DeeJ has commented on this forum that the longer TTK "allows for more interesting gunfights". The problem is that NOBODY is having those gunfights, because (unlike Halo) Destiny allows players to move very fast and unpredictably. So---especially at high levels of the game----it becomes very difficult to kill someone with a primary weapon. YOu can COMPLETE tactical surprise on a good player of this game....and that 0.8 sec TTK....compared with the speed and elusiveness of movement abilities like Blink, Shadestep, and Titan skating...can allow them AMPLE time to evade your fire and escape to safety. Which is why...the higher up you go....t he more play centers around 1v1s being settled with special weapons, supers and other abiltiies, rather than primary weapons. Simply because good players don't leave themselves exposed long enough to die to primary weapon unless they've made a mistake. So the issue is not one of balance of primaries versus primaries. Its about primaries versus specials....and a primary weapon TTK that is appropriate to the speed at which the game moves.... ...and we are NOWHERE near that right now.
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Taking out radar completely fixes your problem and that is my whole point. Secondaries are effectively nerfed when you can't see where the enemy players are 24/7...
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Edited by JungleofTaxemes: 10/29/2016 9:45:16 AMThat means they are buffed because you don't even know where the warrior is any more, they can just skate around the map 'til they find you and you'll never get enough time on target to put them down because you can't track them. Radar slows game pace down, it doesn't make it faster. Radar is needed in Destiny. Maybe with a touch less range but it makes the game play in a less pathological way.
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If shotgun players are getting the better of you without radar you aren't playing right.
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With a effective setup and communication you will see the skating shotgun player and team shot him. Watch the youtube video FizZoR explains everything even how to counter shotgun players.
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I been saying this all the time... if not in all pvp make it work in trials... inferno... meaning no radar... don't spawn in with special... this will really see who knows the map... and who had gunskills let alone who can actually use their primary
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Bungie already tried that. People hauled IceBreakers and side arms into the event to try to bypass the lack of special ammo. ...and when they couldn't do that, play simply didn't START until the first special ammo boxes dropped. Which is why Bungie abandoned the effort. The problem in the Crucible is that the game's primary weapons are underpowered with respect to the speed at which Guardians can move. Until Bungie addresses this, everything else is rearranging the deck chairs on The Titanic.
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They tried it.... but they gave up and just decided when you switch it takes away your ammo. I'm saying it should be like inferno... where you spawn in with no special... same for sidesarms. They can try and switch to icebreaker.... but when they switch it takes away all the ammo. Therefore it forces people to actually use primary. And yes I do agree primary are underpowered, and is desperate for a buff
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Word man glad about the changes to trials this week.
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Wait what are the changes for trials this week?
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No revives no radar hop on twitch if you want to see.
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Wow. Play will be even more campy and passive than it is already.....
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Edited by Aggility: 10/28/2016 9:00:45 PMNo radar isn't passive. LOL if anything it is more fast paced than radar will ever be. Get on twitch and tell me how many people are sitting behind doorways scoped in with sniper rifles. None because that doesn't work without radar.
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Go play Titanfall. In that game you don't show up on the map unless you fire a weapon...and not at all if you've got a silencer equipped. To the extent that camping works in that game....people used to post up in areas where they could look down on high-traffic areas and pick people off. Many of the smaller maps in this game have long sightlines, and few-if-any flanking routes.
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I am not saying I dislike the game I liked it enough to get ripped off by Activision and pay for DLC that should have been in the game. I am saying that in the most competitive format of Destiny there should be no radar.
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My type of game😋😋😋
