[quote]Congratulations on ruining your game in less than 5 minutes Bungie. Seriously? No ascendant material from breaking down the queens legendary items? They're absolute garbage, what's the point of doing the kill orders now?[/quote] -Despite the demeanor by which you've expressed your post, and how this could have been approached differently, I agree that the items for purchase from the emissary are just average. That's the items FOR SALE by the Queens emissary. -The actual "awards" from the Wrath missions themselves cannot be deemed as "garbage . You have not obtained all possible rewards from the Wrath missions, and garbage by definition is something useless. Of which the rewards are not, "because" those rewards DO in fact have stats that can be useful to someone. Just not useful to "you". So unfortunately your opinion of Wrath Mission rewards is in fact invalid when stated this way. [quote]Increased spawn times to get rid of farming? What the hell do you expect us to do now? The same boring ass strike missions? Which now also have DECREASED engram drops? [/quote] -If I'm not mistaken there appears to mostly be a 30-34 second differential between "what was" and now "what is" the spawn times at those FIVE listed locations. SAYING "the boring strike missions"... where you are required to complete an objective is BORING in contrast to "farming" creatures 6-10 seconds a pop in just one location with no objective whatsoever clearly states "you" are exactly the reason WHY Bungie did this. You just stated in your post you prefer to stand in one spot repeatedly and without a goal to be rewarded, as opposed to working towards a goal to be rewarded. In respect not deserved, being told in a way you did not earn, you are the reason why this happened. -You stated you prefer farming creatures at a 6-10 second spawn rate INSTEAD of working towards a goal for rewards in a strike mission. If I was wrong on this, your defense would not have been "boring ass strike missions". You.... are..... lazy. Plain and simple lazy. We are talking you are floating at the bottom of the ocean with your mouth open waiting for decaying matter (engram rewards) to float aimlessly in it LAZY. Mostly 30 seconds. That's the difference. And you're literally angry about THIRTY SECONDS. That's disgusting. It's morose. [quote]If you're going to do that increase the RNG. If we now [b]have to[/b] spend 4 hours doing the same repetitive strikes to get ONE legendary. It better -blam!-ing be a legendary and not a Goddamn rare. I mean come on now, you've officially turned this into a mediocre multiplayer FPS. [/quote] -"Have to"? Ummm.... You're whole argument is based on "NOT HAVING TO". Look at what you wrote. You're complaining you have to wait additional 30 seconds for repeated spawning for farming when you claim four hours minimum for strikes? So 30 seconds added to your farming justifies BlTCHING when strike missions take "you" four hours? Holy krap . If strike missions take YOU four hours no wonder you're farming. You're either inept or incapable of anything more than sitting at a cave and spending four hours shooting at it. Somebody call Guinness Records. L A Z Y [quote]I have never in my life been more disappointed with a Bungie product.[/quote] You won't sell it. You'll accept 30 seconds in the MOST DISAPPOINTING GAME YOUVE EVER HAD FROM BUNGIE. You're too LAZY to work for rewards. You're too lazy to return it. And I wouldn't be shocked if you're sitting there licking your lips and rubbing your finger tips together for your next "prop yourself up against a rock like an inflatable doll facing a cave" to continue to spend hours shooting in one direction for engrams. Look at you. You're still doing it. Look at the areas he's been in. Not only is he full of it, he's still doing it anyway. ROFL [quote]Much to my satisfaction, I would say 90% of the replies agreed with the main points of my irritation. [/quote] UH HUH. Post a poll. With THIS EXACT SAME ARTICLE YOUVE POSTED. I dare you Mr. 90%. Go ahead. Let's SEE this 90% approval of your whining approval rating. Yea. Cause yer full of SHlT. [spoiler] 68% of the populace educated between the last 15-23 gaming consensus years are within a demographic of below average intelligence. The only demographic this post caters to would be the below average in agreement with it. [/spoiler]

Dude you camped the cave wayyyy too much? 25,000 kills on patrol... Get a life lol

Alright, I think I should at least provide some oversight here. I do indie game development and game modding as a hobby (10+ wonderful years of it, might I add), and I can tell you for a fact that even I had a better route that should have been taken than this patch, which in my opinion feels rushed out more than anything else. So, this is going to be the prelude "long-post" warning, so... be warned about that first. Second warning, this post will infuriate individuals who have been whining about the so called "Cave" being an "exploit", get over it, I'm going to prove you wrong in this post and you're not going to like it. So, let's start by talking about what they did wrong today. First and foremost, they pretty much eliminated two sources of legitimate MMO loot gain, and let me make this loud and clear, while you think it isn't, this game most definitely classifies by definition as an MMO. Not only that, they had the nerve to call it an "exploit", which I can also assure you, is not. They have obvious controls over the spawn timers everywhere, if this was an exploit, then it'd be something they missed in the game's code that would cause more problems in the game than something silly like a change in one number (that's all that happened, by the way, one number was changed). Let's stay on this topic for just a minute here. So, if all we're changing is one number to change a spawning rate of enemies, I have two very good question, if this is an "economy exploit" as some (and bungie's new post) would call it, then answer me these two questions: 1) Why was this not patched a week ago when it became popular? 2) What economy are we talking about here? The answer to the first is very obvious, it's because we have people complaining that others found a way to get loot by using a tactic employed by every single MMO game ever created, farming. So, we have these inexperienced players who think they're all "big and bad" and try to "police" the community, even though they have no comprehension of game development or design. And how did they get away with it, simple, they use the big "E" word to try to flag this as something it is not. Before we continue, let me provide you with the actual definition of that word as it relates to video games: [quote]In video games, an exploit (colloquially sploit) is the use of a bug or glitches, game system, rates, hit boxes, or speed, etc. by a player to their advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers. Common types of exploits include: * Duplicating * Lag or Disconnection * Geometry Manipulation * Movement * Safe Zones[/quote] Now, let's again go over this. Bungie here, is going to change one number because people think farming is an exploit. There's just one problem here, "farming" is not in that list, ergo, it is not an exploit, also ergo, the cave farming method is not an exploit. So, let's talk about point number two. They called it an "economy exploit", but there isn't an economy in this game to begin with, not without a proper trading system at least. So, in conclusion, they removed the loot farming because a bunch of whiney five year olds complained about it using the word "exploit", and bungie answered with some silly response to try to justify doing it. Ok, so that ends the first problem. The second problem is removing the dismantle awards here from the gear earned in the Queen's Wrath missions. I don't understand the purpose of doing this when you're limited to the amount of wrath mission gear you can get in a day (fits the current system), and the fact that the Queen's Wrath is a limited time event. Finally, it's hurting the game to enforce PvP objectives for an ultimate PvE experience, this is a big design no-no. These point bring to conclusion what they did wrong today with their latest patch to the game. I'm not sure if they skipped some basic design rules courses or have a comprehension on something big, but "their vision for Destiny" ended at the release of the game. One of the biggest rules of game development is once your product hits the shelf, the direction is no longer dictated by the developer, but the community, because they are the ones who purchase the game, and support it beyond the release. A game without a community is dead in the water. Don't believe me? What do you think will happen to their "10 year plan" come December if there is a sharp decline in the consumers to buy the first expansion for the game. Well, it dies, and so does the game, and I don't think that'll do well for their little "agreement" with Activision. Business and development tactics agree that in order to be successful with your product, it needs to cater to the masses. Now, let's talk about what they "should" have done today. I'll keep this section a little shorter: * In Regards to the Cave: If they wanted to "nerf" the cave, you need to fix the reason for players resorting to it first. The problem here is that rewards for doing the activities in the game are minimal and completing tough things like bosses have no chances of earning Legendaries (as it should), and then you have the dreaded Cryptarch implementing a secondary RNG into loot rewards forced players to resort to legitimate MMO tactics to earn loot in the most efficient way. Today should not have patched the cave if they wanted to nerf it, only to say that they were "going to do it" in the future after they patched the Cryptarch and the mission rewards. That way, people could still earn loot in a favorable manner up until the point where the cave was no longer needed as a valid earning method. * Queen's Bounty Changes: Instead of "removing" the Shards from dismantling equipment, they should have removed the PvP bounties from the list, and simply dropped the shards from dismantling the gear to 1 or 2. If they're not happy about people getting up to Level 27+ then you shouldn't have only had a limited selection of things to do at launch. Add some more events to cater the crowd here, not to mention, you still need to have 3 pieces of raid gear to be level 30, and not everyone can do it. You already have a "big PvP" event coming up in two weeks time, why do we need more PvP content in our PvE experience? Answer: We Don't. So, finally we have come to the point of what needs to be done, and preferably within the next 24 hours. * Bungie needs to issue a formal apology to the community. They made a mistake, and they need to own up to that mistake, and then they need to make things right. They then need to dispatch their "Forum Ninjas" to clean up all of the topics bashing cave farmers and issue temporary bans to anyone who participated in today's bashing, this is still Grieving as it is defined, and not enforcing your own ToS is bad. * The "loot cave" needs to be reverted back to it's "loot granting" status with the 6 second timer. Still understand, if this is a game for connecting with players in social groups, that communication is still encouraged at the cave, because you still need to make sure nothing gets away, and to be cautious of falling Warsats and chaos events, trust me, that's quite a social creating experience. You can "Re-nerf" it once you fix the main problems in the game. * PvP Bounties need to be removed from the Queen's Wrath and the gear needs to be reverted to contain 1-2 Ascendant Materials. * Finally, and the most important thing. Bungie needs to start being more truthful in their patching of the game. Instead of pulling out some random bull about how you're patching "economy exploits", they need to be truthful to their reasoning from this point forward. It would also be nice if they would issue patch notes 20 - 30 minutes before the patches are sent out so we can at least see what's coming down the pipe before be get kicked back to orbit randomly wondering what's going on. And that covers everything. Seriously though, Bungie needs to start having a more active role in this community, and the developers should be participating in these discussions. If they want to create an enjoyable experience for everyone, then they need to start catering to everyone here instead of simply doing stuff and only finding out it's catering to a few complaining 5 year olds, and the biggest thing here, is that you need to fix the underlying problems, and fix problems in the correct order.

I really have to respectfully disagree with almost every point you have made. Every choice they've made so far is for the game's betterment. The loot cave was seriously a cheap way of getting loot. Don't get me wrong, totally exploited it. However spending hours and hours as many people did, farming the cave is not really "playing". You get all the loot very quickly and... then what? The excitement is playing and hoping and playing some more. Sure, I wish the game had a bit more story content and not all of it locked away with the grimoire cards, but all in all I come back to it every day because its an amazing game. Saying they ruined the game is more than overly dramatic and it just sounds like more of self entitlement and instant gratification. Its been out 2 weeks. Thats not long especially for how large this game is. The only actually legitimate issue is the connectivity issue. Other than that it just seems like people must, MUST, complain about something. This game will never be perfect for people who demand everything. Take a breath, relax and enjoy playing. Everyone who is complaining and yet still playing don't really have much to truly complain about, do they?

Don't you people read the news? [quote]The 1.0.2 patch will go live next week, and includes several changes to the Cryptarch and Engram experience. These changes guarantee that Engrams will always decode into items at or above the quality of an engram. Only Engrams that drop after 1.0.2 are subject to this change. Cryptarch Changes  Cayde-6 took the Cryptarch aside and showed him a sack of doorknobs. He decoded that mystery pretty quickly. • Legendary Engrams will always produce Legendary or better quality items, including Materials or Exotics • Rare Engrams will always produce Rare or better quality items • Rare engrams will have an increased chance to produce Legendary quality items Activity Changes • Daily Heroics, Weekly Heroics, and Vanguard: Tiger Playlist activities will include Rare and Legendary Engrams in addition to their existing rewards Item Changes • Ascendant materials have been promoted to Legendary to closer associate them with the gear they are used to upgrade • Legendary Engram items that exist in your inventory will be demoted to Rare quality when the patch goes live, so decode them while you can. But let’s be honest--even if you don’t, we all know they were blues already...[/quote]

Completely agree about farming, it's a horrendous decision. I was only using to bolster armor and weapons parts as I don't have dozens of hours to grind through missions and strikes just for essential parts. Bungie's decisions on patches are of concern as they are not improving the game but making it far more of a drag, instead of enjoying a hard or impossible strike I will just have to grind through them so I level up and do the fun ones!

Hmmmmm lol

It's a loot based game. You are expecting to get all this badass stuff right out the front door. I'd say its not the game but your expectations that are screwed up. I have played games where it takes MONTHS to get a legendary drop. We were all a little spoiled from the start. Now they have taken steps to fix it. Stop crying.

I actually agree with the changes they are pushing forward today. THANK YOU BUNGIE!

Can somebody call 343 to help Bungie finish destiny?

I'm am so angry at bungie, I paid 90 bucks for this game. I should be allowed to to what I want in the game world, not what you tell me to. If I want to farm a freaking cave, rather than do the same stupid raid 20 times in a week, then let me farm the f'ing cave!

You're upset about THIS?! Hundreds of thousands of people that gave their HARD EARNED DOLLAR for this game ,Havent even been able to LOG ON for d*mn near a week now! ...And you wanna complain about doing a little hard work for your shiny little armor, lol the nerve!