[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] anton1792 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Primo84 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] anton1792 "expansionism"[/quote]I have a feeling that it was just a sloppy nod to [i]Cryptum[/i] and ancient humanity. [/quote] Quite possibly. I hated it in the Forerunner trilogy as well; pretty much the only gripe I had with Bear's work. I think that it is a really silly theme. Ancient Humanity being these xenophobes, "purists" and genocidal seems more than a little extreme. And then Glasslands comes out and tells me that it isn't an arc, it's just there, as if it is some integrated part of the fiction now. Now we have to put up with the Forerunner/Sangheili equivalent of [url=http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/CantArgueWithElves]this[/url]. With the Forerunners it sort of fit because they were already established as this great transcended race (I still don't get the roots of this "Humans are Bastards" trope though) but with the Sangheili it seems as if they have been altered to fit that role; stuff has just been made up and thrown in so that someone on the writers board can fill the fiction with as much aimless cynicism as possible. I wouldn't mind it if other races were no better, but it is just turning out to be one of those tropes I guess where aliens cease to be believably and relatable characters in their own right, and just become Mary Sutopias and authorial mouthpieces, complete with the full set of handwavy reasons as to why they don't have the same issues Humanity has. I just don't think it fits Halo's tone; Halo has always been slightly optimistic despite being in a borderline Grimdark setting. I think that's why I can't seem to enjoy much of the newer fiction since Cryptum; the tone is almost completely different, in some cases diametrically opposed, such as the case of the Sangheili in Glasslands.[/quote] I don't believe that because From the point of view those statements were given in, the forerunners. Of course they are going to see any expansion other than their own as "excessive" Even bornstellar picked up and pointed out the hypocrisy. [quote] "Humans are naturally purists. They resent having to live with other species. In fact, they're among the most contentious, bigoted, selfcentered" He looked back at Riser and Chakas. "I never understood how my wife tolerated them." "[u]Forerunners don't like living with other species, either," I observed.[/u] "[b][u]Yes, but for good reason," the Didact said. "We enforce the Mantle. We must focus and protect and preserve all lifeincluding ourselves."[/b][/u][/quote] So it wasn't right for the humans to expand yet it was fine for the forerunners to add more worlds to the millions they already own because they follow the mantle. You can easily see the hypocrisy and justification for such in that passage. Then there is this. [quote] For these dreams spoke of leave-taking and farewell, of the last night before a grand battle that would spread across a hundred thousand light-years to determine the fate of a [b]thousand suns and twenty thousand worlds.[/b][/quote] [quote] This knowledge, however acquired, is what forced the Forerunners to preserve remnants of those they defeated, rather than wipe us from the slate of history, as they had so many others before."[/quote] Seeing as there are millions upon millions of planets in this galaxy i see no issue with the humans controlling 20,000 worlds compared to the forerunners 3 [b]million[/b]. Not to mention humanity has been the only race stated to escape forerunner dominance to such a degree. If the humans were so violent with other species i wouldn't expect the amount of concern Yprin Showed at the though of the forerunners erasing them. [quote] My privilegeto be born and raised all unaware of what Forerunners had had to do to protect their position in the galaxy: moving opposing civilizations and species aside, taking over their worlds and their resources, undermining their growth and developmentreducing them to a population of specimens. Making sure their opponents could never rise again, never present a threat to Forerunner dominance, all while claiming the privilege of protecting the Mantle. Mopping up after the slaughter. How many species had collapsed beneath our hypocrisy, stretching how far back in time? What was myth, what was nightmare, what was truth? My life, my luxury rising from the crushed backs of the vanquished, who were destroyed or deevolved[/quote] Case point.