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4/24/2010 12:51:36 AM
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The Return of the Spiker: My Argument for its Revival. Updated 2!

[quote][b]Warning: Thread contains Inductive Reasoning[/b] Commenting after reading this thread without understanding the nuances of [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inductive_reasoning]Inductive Reasoning[/url] may result in mass ridicule. [b]Warning: Original Poster sucks at writing succinctly [/b] For those of you who lack the stamina required to read well thought-out essays: you have been warned, I will make no compromises for your lack of focus.[/quote] [quote][b]New Information![/b] Scroll down to the 7th post to read about a recent discovery that strongly points to the Spiker's return in Reach! It's more or less indirectly confirmed now! [b]New Information![/b] Scroll down to the 7th post to see a picture from E3 where a Spiker can be spotted in the hands of a Brute. [b]New Information![/b] Scroll down to the 7th post to see the first Video Footage of the Spiker being used by the Player![/quote] [quote][/quote][b]Introduction[/b][quote][/quote] Today I am here to discuss the past, the present, and the future of the [url=http://www.bungie.net/News/content.aspx?cid=12237]Type-25 Carbine[/url]. Adept at filling the air with swarms of low-velocity superheated spikes, the "Spiker" is the primary weapon of choice for Brute Infantry. It is dual-wieldable, unique, awesome, and happens to be my favorite weapon in Halo. Ever since that summer day in my AP Physics class where my class mates and I huddled around a single computer to watch the first Halo Reach Trailer with wonder and excitement in our eyes, I've been searching for signs of the Spiker in Reach. At the time of this writing, the Spiker has not been confirmed to be in or out of Reach by Bungie, and its inclusion or removal has been a fairly frequent topic in the Halo Reach Forum. Although I have posted in many of these threads, sharing different evidence, insights, and reasoning, I've yet to hone and sharpen my thoughts and unite them together into one masterpiece. But now, after nearly a month of brainstorming, drafting, and revising, I bring you my evidence for why I believe it is likely that the Spiker will return in Halo Reach. I've worked hard to step away from my emotions and fairly evaluate the probability of the Spiker returning in Reach with cold hard facts and intelligence. I've crafted this thread with several groups of people in mind. First, for the intellectuals of the forum. Please, examine my argument, attack it with everything you have, and try to break it. You did a very good job of this with my [url=http://www.bungie.net/Forums/posts.aspx?postID=41989722]Spartan Laser Thread[/url]. Because you broke that argument completely, it helped me to understand why the Spartan Laser's return in Halo Reach wasn't as bad as I originally thought. Don't expect it to be so easy this time around however, my "hate" of the Spartan Laser is insignificant compared to my Love for the Spiker. Second, for the people who might have seen me on the forums, but just assumed that I am some sort of Spiker Fan Boy who believes that the Spiker will be in Reach because [i]"Bungie wouldn't dare mess with my favorite weapon."[/i] Please learn how horrifically wrong you are. I've put a lot of thought into this, and I won't have you writing me off until you hear the full story. There is a reason to why I say [i]"The Spiker is likely to return in Reach"[/i] with such confidence. Finally, to the people who blindly trust every word I say, I'd at least want to give you some background to why I came to this conclusion so that if you ever find yourself under attack for claiming that the Spiker will return in Reach, you will at least know how to go about defending yourself. [quote][/quote][i]"Why do you think the Spiker will be in Reach"[/i] you ask? This is a bit of a difficult question to answer, and I'm not sure exactly where I should start. As a writer, it's much easier for me to explain my theory to you by presenting the common arguments for why the Spiker won't be in Reach, then counter them one by one. I've compiled six major arguments today, and I am willing to add more should you people craft some new ones which challenge my conclusion. The original post is comprised of seven posts total, so I wish you luck with finishing it. [quote][/quote][quote][b]Argument 1)[/b] [i]Spikers are weapons used only by Brutes. I heard that there won't be any Brutes in Halo Reach, so it makes no sense for there to be Spikers in Halo Reach.[/i][/quote][quote][/quote] This argument commonly comes from people who haven't been following the development of this game closely. There is no crime in making an assumption like this when you don't have all the details available for you to digest, so allow me to quickly and kindly correct your misunderstanding. Brutes are in Reach. They have been indirectly confirmed twice by Bungie. The first time that they were confirmed was in the First Halo Reach Vidoc: [url=http://www.bungie.net/projects/reach/vidaudio.aspx?c=58&i=24782]Once More Unto The Breach[/url]. At about 4:33 into the video, you will clearly see an artist working on a new brute model for Halo Reach (the brute model is on the left screen, Brute concept art from Halo 3 is on the right screen). For those of you who are lazy and don't mind my funny red annotations, I have a [url=http://i868.photobucket.com/albums/ab249/Hylebosaiden/Bnet%20Image%20Resources/OMGBRUTES.jpg]screencap[/url] of this picture for your viewing pleasure. Why would they show footage in the vidoc of a character model that won't be in the final game? The second time that they were confirmed was in the [url=http://downloads.bungie.net/podcasts/Bungie_Podcast_30910.mp3]03/09/10 Bungie Podcast[/url]. The guest of this show was the Reach Audio Lead: Jay Weinland. At about 30 minutes into the podcast, the following exchange occurs: [quote] [b]29:58 Brian Jarrard:[/b] And then I guess you guys are also dealing with redefining a Grunt speaking a native dialog versus an Elite versus all of the Covenant. [b]Jay Weinland:[/b] Yup, it's a totally different take there I guess, totally different take, and we've come up with a way to actually write English words and then transmogrify them into an Alien Language which... [b]Brian Jarrard:[/b] Yeah, I heard that a real formal language was created, sort of melding together some other things that are out there and then you guys are like: "guess we'll apply some processing to the final recording to make..." [b]Jay Weinland:[/b] Yeah, apply some processing to make it sound more [b][u]Brutey[/b][/u], or more Elitey, or more Grunty. [b]Brian Jarrard:[/b] That's awesome. [b]Jay Weinland:[/b] So yeah, that's going to be good times, we've already recorded a couple of grunts, we're getting our Elites and [b][u]Brutes[/u][/b] here in Seattle. [/quote] Why would they need to record dialog for Brutes if they aren't going to be in the game? Now, some of you might not be entirely convinced. I've heard all sorts of justifications for why Brutes won't be in Reach despite the prior two bits of evidence. [i]"Brutes will be in cut scenes only and we won't ever fight them"[/i] or [i]"Bungie says that all details are subject to change, so they could easily come to their senses and removes Brutes from Reach before they ruin Campaign."[/i] To be blunt, these are feeble weak arguments which aren't likely to occur. I understand that some of you people may be nervous about reintroducing Brutes into Halo Reach when they didn't do so well in Halo 2 or Halo 3, but there are a variety of reasons why Brutes in Reach won't suck as much as in prior games. The important thing is that there are Brutes in the game, so we know that Spikers won't be taken out just because Brutes are absent. But Brutes have not been as consistent in their presentation throughout previous Halo games, which brings us to our next argument. [quote][/quote][b]Continued on Page 2[/b][quote][/quote] [Edited on 09.09.2010 5:46 PM PDT]
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#Halo #Reach

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  • Wow And I thought I wanted the spiker a lot.

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  • [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Tesla 123 china called, they want their wall back[/quote] The year 2000 called, they want their joke back. Man i love that. ON TOPIC: Good job on the thread, i hope the spiker makes it in!

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  • Spiker sucked in H3. Period.

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  • I've just started using the spiker in Halo 3, and it's almost better than the AR. And you can have two! :D [Edited on 06.04.2010 3:02 PM PDT]

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  • holy -blam!- didnt read it yet but wow, you pretty much wrote a novel about the spiker

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  • I think Bungie should keep the spiker but... just in case they dont... Hylebos, my hugs are cry-proof. <(^_^)> [Edited on 06.04.2010 3:00 PM PDT]

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  • I'm all for the Spike Rifle making a return, I just want it to pin me to walls. I'll die a happy Spartan then.

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  • [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] RighteousTyrant You really wrote 6 full posts of Spiker stuff? . . . <-- speechless[/quote] What can I say? My college English Teacher taught me well. Given the proper motivation six pages is nothing to me.

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  • You really wrote 6 full posts of Spiker stuff? . . . <-- speechless

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  • [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SenatorKooch If we see it, I think it'll be campaign only. I also think we'll only see Brutes briefly. Why tout the horn of Elites back as what they were like in CE only to have Brutes ruin it?[/quote] I have kinda come to terms with the likely possibillity that the Spiker won't be in default mulitplayer, but I still have hope. As for Brutes, I'd imagine that they'd be like hunters with regards to their rarity. A sort of special encounter that really tries the protagonist to survive.

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  • I finally took the time to read this, good write up. I think in some cases you had great evidence. I think all of this points to the possibility of the Spiker being in the game, but I don't think we can call it confirmed. Maybe it was in the game and they cut it because it wasn't unique enough but didn't flush all its assets out and that's why you see the stats image. If we see it, I think it'll be campaign only. I also think we'll only see Brutes briefly. Why tout the horn of Elites back as what they were like in CE only to have Brutes ruin it?

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  • They might change the spiker so that it is more of a rifle now, But I'm not sure. As for Brutes appearing in Reach... I'd like to see how they cooperate with the Elites. It would be interesting. And assasination animation on Brutes? I want to see that epicness. Well, we kind of already saw something like that in ODST... whenthe Brute Chieftan got killed by a knife to the neck...

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  • bump

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  • [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Awesome Soul The dual needler was very OP, thats why they made it single. [/quote] It was WHAT? Every kill you got with the dual needlers was a miracle from on high. I got a triple kill with them once on lockout and I could hear angels singing. They were the most underpowered weapon in all of halo history. No contest.

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  • Lol, Gravity Shot? Interesting. Were you trying to be funny when you said that brutes were the masters of gravity? Sounded funny to me.

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  • One thing has always confused me about the Spiker: The Spikes themselves. For one thing, they are longer than the clip you put in the weapon (Hell, they are nearly as long as the Spiker itself!). With that thing addressed, how could such large spikes be put into a clip of 40? I mean, all of them couldn't fit into the clip itself or the gun itself. It defies physics!

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  • That was really smart. And long. I'll just agree with you. I love spikers anyways

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  • [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Hylebos [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Elite Predator I can see a spiker rifle coming along... oh wait we have a needler rifle. Well how about an assault spiker... oh wait we have the plasma reapeater. It seems that all the possible upgrades for the spiker (if there is one) will be "duplicates" of other guns in Reach.[/quote] And yet, [url=http://www.bungie.net/images/reachstats/weapons/spiker.png]Spiker.[/url] Mysterious isn't it?[/quote] Hylebos, I don't really understand. The new spiker doesn't look much different then the old spiker.

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  • I think the whole argument/researching/thought put into this was in vein. IMO Bungie was already going to put it in. I didn't read past page 1 because it is an INCREDIBLY long story for reasoning, but I hated the spikers. They were barely used by alot of players.

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  • I read the whole first six posts, and don't feel like wading through 23 pages, so I don't know if this has already been addressed: I have a feeling that they are going to do something like what they did with turning the plasma rifle into the repeater. Make it bigger for lack of dualing, which may result in bigger magazines. Give it an aesthetic overhaul, but keep it recognizable as the Spiker so that someone can figure out what it does before they shoot (square shape with double bayonets and all that). My own creative ideas are that it will have a little better range now that it isn't an SMG equivalent. Maybe it could have headshot capabilities with headshot-capable-accuracy for the first five or so shots until it starts blooming out at a high rate. After reading this, I'm definitely looking forward to cooler brutes and cooler Brutey stuff.

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  • Very good argument with great backup reasons. While spikers weren't very enjoyable for me in halo 3, with dual weilding gone and the brutes free to be brutal like they always should have been, I now hope spikers are in.

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  • The arguement is air-tight. good work hylebos. btw, that post you made on the "official impolite and self righteous feedback forum" was hysterical. i should get a t-shirt for surviving both walls of text. again, good arguement. i hope theres spikers in reach, just for you.

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  • [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Lebayak [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] InboundTMAN36 DUDE! to much man. youve crossed a line that no one would read it........ also modders beat you to it and found the spiker FAIL[/quote] He didn't fail. He won. Cue [i]Peril[/i] from H2 soundtrack.[/quote]Best Halo song ever.

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  • One of the changes I would like to see that would certainly make it unique would be making it a semi-burst-fire weapon. Not at all like the BR , but more like a controlled AR in terms of fire power, but with much more kick, recoil, and damage power in each shot.

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  • You can't predict Bungie's actions. They may have been rushed in the process of Halo 2 and when Halo 3 came around they removed the Brute Plasma Rifle, but when they dropped ODST the Brute Plasma Rifle was found once more. So they can just pop it in Reach once more. They can also throw it in the campaign and only campaign like the Plasma Rifle. Since the brutes arn't a primary army they might as well just stick to regular covey weapons. They could handle neerfles, needlers, or just plasma rifles. Just don't get your hopes up because you know how to write multiple walls of text.

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  • [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Tesla 123 china called, they want their wall back[/quote] Its a wall of pure intelligence though I've got to say, only hylebos can make an 8 page post about the spiker, just like you made a 1 page rant asking about the spiker in urks rant thread. (That was hilarious) I agree with your thread 100% I actually read all the way through. Hylebos did you ever consider the idea of going into video game journalism? I think you would do quite well. Your posts are very well thought out, they make sense, are clear and well written out. I'm amazed by how much you can think to write. When I try to convince someone of something I run out of stuff to write. You should seriously consider a job in writing reviews or something of that sort.

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