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Agustus

Agustus

10/12/2009 10:01:36 PM
[i]Critically acclaimed! Read what the critics have been raving about![/i] [quote][b]Person25-[/b] "Whatever you are smoking, hook me up."[/quote] [quote][b]Lord Snakie[/b] He outdid three years of me making random theories influenced by how tired I was and how much I wanted to mess with people in one day? Son of a.... [/quote] [quote][b]Wolverfrog[/b] *Head asplodes*[/quote] [B] WARNING. DO NOT PASS THIS POINT IF YOU SUFFER ANY HEART INFLICTIONS, AS IT MAY LEAD TO STROKE AND OR DEATH.[/B] [b]Intro:[/b] I have always been very spectacle about a direct Marathon Halo story link. I was the guy who always said "Your a moron if you think that, Bungie stated there is no direct link." Now out a pure irony, fate seems to find it amusing to make me believe. And thats what this thread is about, Fate. The place (and time?) you will read here may be the most ridiculous thing you have ever to lay eyes upon in this forum. Where this thread journeys, there is no canon, there is no [i]fact[/i], there is only hypothetical thinking that defies all laws of nature and common sense. It may very well be impossible for one human mind to comprehend. [b]Basic Theory Origin[/b] Recently i've been playing much Marathon. Maybe a little [i]too[/i] much. I was fascinated by the similarities of Master Chief and the security guard you play in Marathon. But what really blew my mind was Marathon: Infinity. If you are playing any of the games right now, and don't wish to be spoiled, please stop. Although I will be as undescriptive as possible of the details. In M:I, basically you travel through space and time by an unknown force. You travel between alternate realities constantly. Its like waking up to find that you where never born, then have to escape the cops because they think you broke into the house you live in. Durandal is a rampant AI in the Marathon games. He has a sense of humor similar to Cortana's as she became rampant, or even before. Where am I getting at? Just give me a minute. Master Chief, the security guard, and even the Rookie all have something in common. There faceless. Almost all of the Bungie main characters are. Now this is where we cross into, [i]the twilight zone[/i].I want you to forget every thing you thought you knew, all your logic and common sense, all your criticism, and make your mind blank and unbiased. The Master Chief was chosen because of [i]luck[/i]. What where the odds he got the right side pf the coin? 50/50. What where the odds he would survive the training? Even less. What where the odds that he survived all the impossible encounters that he survived? 1 in a million? Yet he does, every time. He is in a way invincible. Every time he faces death, the impossible happens. [i]He escapes[/i]. As is the same with our Marathon Cyborg (which makes the same initials). [quote]I have been Roland, Beowulf, Achilles, Gilgamesh. I have been called a hundred names and will be called a thousand more before the world goes dim and cold. I am hero.[/quote] Beowulf, Achilles, and other legendary heros, all invincible. In not saying that you could shoot them in the head and they would survive. Im saying that [i]you never would be able to[/i]. They are invincible in the sense that they are lucky. Skilled, but lucky. MC (presumably) is saying he has been them all. Like reincarnation. In essence, they are all the same man. His soul reborn after eventual death. being born again in different times, and different universes. Want a little more supporting evidence? I would be happy to oblige. [quote] We've watched while the stars burned out, and creation played in reverse. The universe freezing in half light. Once I thought to escape. To end the end a master, step out of the path of collapse. Escape would make us God. Yet I cannot help remember one enigma. A hybrid, elusive destroyer. This is the only mystery I have not solved. The only element unaccounted for. Even S'buth is no more, he saved his entire race, but in the end, frozen by despair. he joined the chaos he sought to evade. But you where dead a thousand times. Hopeless encounters successfully won. A man long dead, grafted to machines your builders did not understand. You follow the path, fitting into an infinite pattern. Yours to manipulate, to destroy and rebuild. Now, in the quantum moment before closure, when all become one. One moment left. One point of space and time. I know who you are. [i]You are Destiny[/i].[/quote] I know you must have a head ache right now. But we still have much to cover. Lets dissect this message piece by piece, and digest its deep and hidden meanings. In the first paragraph, the writer (presumably Durandal) says he watched creation play in reverse. The universe ending, almost Armageddon. This is the point of closure, when time just [i]ends[/i]. I will explain this latter, but we need to focus on the other part. [quote]Escape would make us God. Yet I cannot help remember one enigma. A hybrid, elusive destroyer. This is the only mystery I have not solved. The only element unaccounted for.[/quote] This is what I am naming MC, both Master Chief and the Marathon cyborg. It clearly reffering to him in every way, a cyborg, and undefeatable. So now that were clear on that, lets move on. [quote]But you where dead a thousand times. Hopeless encounters successfully won. A man long dead, grafted to machines your builders did not understand.[/quote] Dead a thousand times? I think this supports my theory that MC are one in the same. As well as other legendary heros. All the same entity reborn, again and again, in different times and realities. For every situation, there are thousands of outcomes that might occur. In the many situations MC faces, he happens to come out on top. Even when your playing, if you make a mistake, time seems to rewind. This could go on forever as you try every possibility and eventually find the correct one. This explains MC being "immortal". As well as the other Hero's. They face the same problem again and again, until they win. Like he is not meant to die, so he experiences the same thing over and over until he realizes his mistake. [i]Luck[/i]. So in essence, you he died a thousand times. And encounters that where all but hopeless, you win. [quote]You follow the path, fitting into an infinite pattern. Yours to manipulate, to destroy and rebuild. Now, in the quantum moment before closure, when all become one. One moment left. One point of space and time. I know who you are. [i]You are Destiny[/i].[/quote] What is this path? What can you destroy manipulate and rebuild? And finally, you are Destiny? If MC is reborn again and again, this explains the infinite pattern. Also the "time reverse" effect you experience as a player. But if MC is not those characters, and is instead the force behind them. Then what is he? Destiny? [quote]We've watched while the stars burned out, and creation played in reverse. The universe freezing in half light. Once I thought to escape. To end the end a master, step out of the path of collapse. Escape would make us God.[/quote] You may be familiar with the real life "Time Paradox" theory. Many believe that if you went back in time, you would change the future. But this theory states, that if you did travel back in time, the future is the way it is [i]because[/i] you went back in time. Lets say in 1999 a dude appears out of no where and claims he is from the future. Then he goes back, somehow effecting the future by the traditional thought. But lets fast forward to 2009. This dude makes a time machine and goes in the past, therefore explaining what you saw. Which means when he "comes back", everything is the same. Because he already went back in time before. If MC did in fact escape the collapse of space and time, the end of that universe (as it is hinted he did). Then its is possible that he crossed into another universe, another reality. Think of it like this: "Universes" are bubbles, once he escaped one, he could walk into others. He would be reborn as any other human (or alien?). But why is he invincible? Because he escaped the reality. Its a time paradox. He escaped, then was reincarnated millennia before he escaped. Then made his way from there. Until he is reborn as MC and escapes once more, starting all over again. Its an "infinite pattern". A never ending circle. Him being unable to die is a law of physics onto itself. The cycle cannot be broken, thus he cannot die. Let me explain it a little bit more. If that person in 2009, was being shot at by lets say cops(before he travels back in time). You would know, no matter what he will escape. Because you saw him in 1999, "after" he went back in time. So in order for the cycle to be complete, he has to live and escape. In order to go back to 1999 and for you to see him. So MC is in the same position. He is reincarnated because he became a god, so in order for him to escape and become a god in the future (completing the circle) he has to survive everything that happens to him. He is a law of nature unto himself. His death would cause the entire space time fabric to unfold, or something to that extent. Therefore, every-time he is reborn he because another great hero. But then if the MC theory is correct, he also crosses in to other universes. Like the Halo universe. This could also have implications for where the Precursors disappeared to. They are remarkably similar to the Jjaro (in marathon) and many theorize they exited this plain of existence. I'll also throw some thought provoking supporting evidence in from the Halo universe itself. [quote]Adjutant Reflex is terminated. Attempt no further communication. I am utilizing its matrix. Everything is within protocol. Tomorrow, things may be clearer but I will not be here to witness the clarity. I am for another place and another time. On my terms. Be seeing you.[/quote] [Edited on 10.13.2009 2:02 PM PDT]

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    Agustus

    Agustus

    10/20/2009 2:25:00 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Mutoid Log I remember reading a MC-Luck-branchoverse-revertToSaved type theory back in summer 2007. I think I regarded it as one of the prime theories. When I first saw Arrival, I was waiting for the "Luck." because of it. [url=http://www.bungie.net/Forums/posts.aspx?postID=11651171&postRepeater1-p=1]Oh, found it.[/url] Lot's of weird and now-false stuff on top, though. And the "Forerunners = Game creators" thing is a rather nice observation.[/quote] That theory is seriously out dates as you said, and is going to get overuned by my next one which covers the Halo back back story as well. Do you know how this user was?
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    Mutoid Log

    Mutoid Log

    10/20/2009 2:01:57 AM Permalink
    I remember reading a MC-Luck-branchoverse-revertToSaved type theory back in summer 2007. I think I regarded it as one of the prime theories. When I first saw Arrival, I was waiting for the "Luck." because of it. [url=http://www.bungie.net/Forums/posts.aspx?postID=11651171&postRepeater1-p=1]Oh, found it.[/url] Lot's of weird and now-false stuff on top, though. And the "Forerunners = Game creators" thing is a rather nice observation.
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    Flutternips
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    Deleted User

    Deleted User

    10/18/2009 11:47:52 PM Permalink
    [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HY-03vYYAjA]*BOOM!!!*[/url] [Edited on 10.19.2009 5:55 PM PDT]
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    Agustus
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    Evanesca

    Evanesca

    10/17/2009 12:11:53 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Placid Platypus No link between the two games exists, period.[/quote] Conventionally speaking, of course. I thought the same thing at times OP, but never really came to grips with it. Or, put it in a way you did.
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    Placid Platypus

    Placid Platypus

    10/16/2009 10:07:08 PM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Agustus [b]Basic Theory Origin[/b] [/quote] After extended consideration.... no. Among the many problems with your theory, the one that stands foremost in my mind is the fact that the Security Officer from the Marathon series is a Battleroid who has literally died before. In the Marathon series, Battleroids were created from the corpses of dead soldiers, something which is quite a different origin story form that of Master Chief. Where I think you are getting confused is in the fact that both series utilize common themes. Unless you want to attempt to formulate some metaphysical link between the two, only thematic similarities from the two games can be shared. No link between the two games exists, period.
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    Wolvers

    Wolvers

    10/16/2009 7:23:11 PM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] MaxRealflugel Another example: If a loved one died several years ago and you went back to prevent their death you would create an alternate reality/universe where your relative/friend survived, but back in your original timeline they would still be dead. [/quote] Don't you watch Doctor Who? Hordes of creatures would come and wreck havok on the world whilst everyone hid in a church. The event which should have killed the loved one will replay again and again until the person you saved accepts their fate. I assumed this was common knowledge. :)
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    Agustus

    Agustus

    10/16/2009 6:54:09 PM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] DrakeBS757 Part 2 confused me at 1st but I understood the whole thing, mostly because I belive/understabnd that particular theory of time travle as well as the concept of ONE being/hero escaping & changing reality due to escape/reincarnation. This is brilliant & praise your brilliance- one of the most coherent, sensible & belivable theories I have seen on B.net[/quote] I don't think may would agree with you on the believable part. But yeah you got it, MC escaped reality becoming an undefeatable god in a sense.
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    DrakeBG757

    DrakeBG757

    10/16/2009 3:58:46 AM Permalink
    Part 2 confused me at 1st but I understood the whole thing, mostly because I belive/understabnd that particular theory of time travle as well as the concept of ONE being/hero escaping & changing reality due to escape/reincarnation. This is brilliant & praise your brilliance- one of the most coherent, sensible & belivable theories I have seen on B.net
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    Agustus

    Agustus

    10/16/2009 3:28:33 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SonicJohn If I'm interpreting your theory correctly, all you're really saying is that: 1. Heroes are born. 2. They are the same soul reincarnate. 3. Master Chief is one such hero. 3. Security Officer is another such hero. If so, they yeah, that's the essential idea behind the "I am hero" concept. It doesn't actually need to mean anything in particular. It doesn't necessarily need to mean that they're in the same Universe (they're often both referred to as "Halo Universe" and "Marathon Universe" respectively). It's just a really legendary concept that rather being born into becoming a hero, the hero is born into you. That's actually the extent of it, really. But then we have to go into the concept of reincarnation, and Otherkin theories, and so on so forth, and honestly, I don't think a lot of people here would appreciate that, really. I love the concept though.[/quote] Thats basically part one. And im not saying its in the same universe, infact, it can only really work if its in a different universe.
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    Sarsion

    Sarsion

    10/16/2009 3:21:46 AM Permalink
    If I'm interpreting your theory correctly, all you're really saying is that: 1. Heroes are born. 2. They are the same soul reincarnate. 3. Master Chief is one such hero. 3. Security Officer is another such hero. If so, they yeah, that's the essential idea behind the "I am hero" concept. It doesn't actually need to mean anything in particular. It doesn't necessarily need to mean that they're in the same Universe (they're often both referred to as "Halo Universe" and "Marathon Universe" respectively). It's just a really legendary concept that rather being born into becoming a hero, the hero is born into you. That's actually the extent of it, really. But then we have to go into the concept of reincarnation, and Otherkin theories, and so on so forth, and honestly, I don't think a lot of people here would appreciate that, really. I love the concept though.
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    Agustus

    Agustus

    10/16/2009 3:15:22 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] furiocity How many times does Bungie need to say no until you get it? There has never been and never will be a direct link between the marathon and halo universe. And the whole "Durandal escaping the closure of the universe" thing is more figurative than anything. It means he wanted to get away before the pfhor and the 11th clan destroyed themselves and possibly everything around them. Even the longest of posts could not validate such a ridiculous theory. Bungie likes to reuse ideas, thats why Halo seems to be so similar to Marathon, because it was really just an evolution of ideas, there is no connection here, the master chief floating out in space has nothing to do with the marathon series. Bungie would not hide such a massive connection like this. [/quote] My theory is not a direct link whatsoever. Its just linking the characters. And who said Bungie "hid" this? What are they supposed to do, come out on TV explaining everything in vivid detail?
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    Havoc 101

    Havoc 101

    10/16/2009 2:53:52 AM Permalink
    I wouldn't get my Infinity info from the bungie wiki, I would get my stuff [url=http://marathon.bungie.org/story/]here.[/url] Much more detail and mind-blowin information on the Marathon Universe than a wiki page can hold. : D [Edited on 10.15.2009 6:54 PM PDT]
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    furiocity

    furiocity

    10/16/2009 2:29:18 AM Permalink
    How many times does Bungie need to say no until you get it? There has never been and never will be a direct link between the marathon and halo universe. And the whole "Durandal escaping the closure of the universe" thing is more figurative than anything. It means he wanted to get away before the pfhor and the 11th clan destroyed themselves and possibly everything around them. Even the longest of posts could not validate such a ridiculous theory. Bungie likes to reuse ideas, thats why Halo seems to be so similar to Marathon, because it was really just an evolution of ideas, there is no connection here, the master chief floating out in space has nothing to do with the marathon series. Bungie would not hide such a massive connection like this. [Edited on 10.15.2009 6:30 PM PDT]
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    Agustus

    Agustus

    10/16/2009 2:21:40 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] MaxRealflugel Loving the theory, Agustus. Usually I'd be inclined to remind you that both Bungie and Marathon are completely different entities, but that's been said already, however, I'm just about to provide another theory which could aide in this one. One area of your (Agustus) theory is the thought of time travel and the resulting paradoxes, but things have changed now in the world of science and time travel. Those scientists that are for the possibility of time travel have always been scuppered by those that are against it who will always resort to their single most powerful argument: The Grandfather Paradox. The Grandfather Paradox, for those not aware, is the theory that if you were travel back in time and kill your Grandfather when he was young and before your Father was born that you would basically end you existence. And if you never existed, how could you travel back in time to kill your Grandfather? Scientists have now come up with another theory that avoids the Grandfather Paradox, altogether. If you go back in time and kill your Grandfather you will, of course, prevent yourself from being born, at least in that timeline. Once you cross the bridge of affecting others in the past you automatically create an alternate timeline/universe which has no effect on your original one. Another example: If a loved one died several years ago and you went back to prevent their death you would create an alternate reality/universe where your relative/friend survived, but back in your original timeline they would still be dead. With this in mind the possibility of universe crossovers increases. This could mean that a lot of things could be possible.[/quote] A heard of this as well. But my argument against the grand father paradox theory is simple. It would never happen because, well, why would you risk it? Your grandfather lets say died in a car crash (after he had your dad or whatever). Even if you tried to kill him before he had your parent, you wouldn't succeed. This is because if you did you would never have been born and thus couldn't kill him. So fate is against you. You shall simply not be successful. Update coming soon!
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    MaxRealflugel

    MaxRealflugel

    10/15/2009 9:10:17 AM Permalink
    Loving the theory, Agustus. Usually I'd be inclined to remind you that both Bungie and Marathon are completely different entities, but that's been said already, however, I'm just about to provide another theory which could aide in this one. One area of your (Agustus) theory is the thought of time travel and the resulting paradoxes, but things have changed now in the world of science and time travel. Those scientists that are for the possibility of time travel have always been scuppered by those that are against it who will always resort to their single most powerful argument: The Grandfather Paradox. The Grandfather Paradox, for those not aware, is the theory that if you were travel back in time and kill your Grandfather when he was young and before your Father was born that you would basically end you existence. And if you never existed, how could you travel back in time to kill your Grandfather? Scientists have now come up with another theory that avoids the Grandfather Paradox, altogether. If you go back in time and kill your Grandfather you will, of course, prevent yourself from being born, at least in that timeline. Once you cross the bridge of affecting others in the past you automatically create an alternate timeline/universe which has no effect on your original one. Another example: If a loved one died several years ago and you went back to prevent their death you would create an alternate reality/universe where your relative/friend survived, but back in your original timeline they would still be dead. With this in mind the possibility of universe crossovers increases. This could mean that a lot of things could be possible.
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    Sardonic13

    Sardonic13

    10/14/2009 12:37:35 PM Permalink
    I'm not trying to discourage you in writing theories. In fact, threads like this are the ones I enjoy the most and the reason I lurk in the Underground. Just don't be surprised when you find that there are some of us whose heads [i]don't[/i] explode just by reading your theories. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Agustus That thing about the pattern buffers made no sense to me because it means 2 things. That anyone can use them, and thus "never die". I never found out what the PB was supposed to represent (certainly not a time control device) in the Marathon universe.[/quote]It has been theorized that the line "But you were dead a thousand times" could also refer to the pattern buffers because they actually made dying and respawning part of the story, rather than simply a consequence for failure. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Agustus 4. When I said Master Chief and the Marathon Cyborg where one in the same. I didn't mean the plots where related in any way. Like you said they where cut from the same piece of cloth. Yet both escape death numerous times, and as warriors are very similar.[/quote]I agree, but I just felt that by using the same abbreviation to describe both characters when discussing the events of Marathon Infinity was a needless confusion that could cause others to think you were making a more direct connection. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Agustus 5. I never got the Jjaro implants thing. Every page i've read of Marathon lore states that the cause of MC flying through universes was unknown, presumably by the chaotic nature of the W'rkncacnter. While I dare not challenge you, as you are obviously more well versed in the subject, it is very possible Bungie put a double meaning in there letters. A deeper meaning.[/quote]Seriously, read all of the Marathon Infinity entries on the [url=http://marathon.bungie.org/story/volunteersseries.html]MSP Volunteers page[/url] in order. They offer an extremely clear and easy to read understanding of all of the levels in Infinity. I didn't truly understand the events of Infinity until I read them. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Agustus 6. You are complete right about trying to keep the universes separate, I got caught up in my ideas. But I have virtually no experience with any other Bungie games.[/quote]Keep at it. Most people never bother to dig very deep into Bungie lore, but doing so is extremely rewarding.
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    Agustus

    Agustus

    10/14/2009 11:25:36 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Sardonic13 [/quote] 1. Is it [i]THE[/i] Mark Levin!? The dude with the radio show!? 2. When I created this thread I predicted 2 things. One was that pepoles heads would esplode. The other was that people more familiar with the story than me would use me as target practice (I am by no means an expert. Skimming throw the games, and Bungie wiki timelines). 3. That thing about the pattern buffers made no sense to me because it means 2 things. That anyone can use them, and thus "never die". I never found out what the PB was supposed to represent (certainly not a time control device) in the Marathon universe. 4. When I said Master Chief and the Marathon Cyborg where one in the same. I didn't mean the plots where related in any way. Like you said they where cut from the same piece of cloth. Yet both escape death numerous times, and as warriors are very similar. 5. I never got the Jjaro implants thing. Every page i've read of Marathon lore states that the cause of MC flying through universes was unknown, presumably by the chaotic nature of the W'rkncacnter. While I dare not challenge you, as you are obviously more well versed in the subject, it is very possible Bungie put a double meaning in there letters. A deeper meaning. 6. You are complete right about trying to keep the universes separate, I got caught up in my ideas. But I have virtually no experience with any other Bungie games.
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    AngasBoy
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    opogjijijp

    opogjijijp

    10/14/2009 7:09:22 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] ODST27 I really wish I new about Marathon's story. I've tried playing the games, but the old visuals and gameplay prevent me from doing so. [/quote] You could still go over to the the Marathon Story Page and read all the terminals. Not quite the same experience as playing, but you'll get the story.
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    ODST27

    ODST27

    10/14/2009 7:01:00 AM Permalink
    I really wish I new about Marathon's story. I've tried playing the games, but the old visuals and gameplay prevent me from doing so. It's not Bungie's fault, though, mainly mine for not being born soon enough to be old enough to appreciate Marathon's story when it was new :(
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    Ender

    Ender

    10/14/2009 5:00:38 AM Permalink
    When I saw this topic, I knew Sardonic would be ready to jump in with a rebuttal. I spent quite some time myself working on a way to connect all of Bungie's games together, but had Sardonic's ever-present iron-clad logic to set me straight! So he has already said everything I wanted to mention about your SO = MC connection. If you're really interested into delving into Marathon's story, read every page in the MSP... or *cough* check out [url=http://www.bungie.net/fanclub/88247/Group/GroupHome.aspx]Theory of Unification[/url], which is my long-dead chapter. We had a lot of in-depth discussions on related topics, as my ultimate goal of the group was to find a tangible connection. Alas, it was not to be!
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    Sardonic13

    Sardonic13

    10/14/2009 3:50:17 AM Permalink
    You bring up some interesting ideas, though none are new. Also, I don't agree with your deliberate confusion of the Security Officer and the Master Chief by using the qualifier "MC" to denote both at the same time. It really only confuses people who are not well versed in both Marathon and Halo lore. First let's explore the meaning of [url=http://marathon.bungie.org/story/mifinalscreen.html]Infinity's Final Screen[/url] in the context of the events of Marathon Infinity, since taking it out of context (as you have done here) only leads to confusion and vague conclusions which may or may not be viable. Infinity's final screen is spoken by Durandal/Thoth as the closure of Marathon's universe is occurring. These words are Durandal's final thoughts. [b][i]We've watched while the stars burned out, and creation played in reverse. The universe freezing in half light.[/i][/b] Durandal opens by describing the gradual steps towards the closure of the universe. Durandal says "we" because he merged with Thoth during the events of Marathon Infinity. [b][i]Once I thought to escape. To end the end a master, step out of the path of collapse. Escape would make us god.[/i][/b] This offers the most direct proof that the entity speaking is in fact Durandal. All of his actions in Marathon 1 and 2 (up until the release the W'rkncacnter) further his ultimate purpose of escaping the closure of the universe. It is interesting to note that Durandal no longer seems infatuated with escaping the closure and has resigned himself to death. Whether this is proof of Thoth's influence or that Durandal has simply grown beyond his obsession with escape is unclear. [b][i]Yet I cannot help but remember one enigma. A hybrid, elusive destroyer. This is the only mystery I have not solved. The only element unaccounted for.[/i][/b] Here is the first mention of the SO: the hybrid, elusive destroyer. Hybrid because he is a cyborg; elusive because of his ability to survive even the most desperate situations. [i][b]Even S'bhuth is no more. He saved his entire race, but in the end, frozen by despair, he joined the chaos he sought to evade.[/b][/i] S'bhuth is the Older (leader) of the S'pht'Kr. The S'pht'Kr are the most advanced clan of the S'pht. They left the S'pht homeworld before the S'pht were enslaved by the Pfhor. S'bhuth and the S'pht'Kr returned in Marathon 2 to rescue the S'pht (and eventually humanity) from the Pfhor. Durandal is saying that where even the leader of the most advanced clan of the S'pht (children of the Jjaro) ultimately could not survive, the SO did survive. [b][i]But you were dead a thousand times. Hopeless encounters successfully won. A man long dead, grafted to machines your builders did not understand. You follow the path, fitting into an infinite pattern. Yours to manipulate, to destroy and rebuild.[/b][/i] This is the most important section describing the SO. He "was dead a thousand times. Hopelsss encounters successfully won". This refers to all of the impossible battles in which he not only survived, but conquered. These include the battles on the Marathon above Tau Ceti, for Durandal's crashed ship on Lh'owon's second moon, and even the struggle against the ultimate chaos of the W'rkncacnter. It could also refer to Marathon's pattern buffers. The SO was literally "a man long dead, grafted to machines your builders did not understand". The SO was a cyborg which, in the Marathon universe, means he was created from the reanimated corpse of a dead soldier. His implants were Jjaro technology. These Jjaro implants were what allowed him to travel between timelines in Marathon Infinity. As Marathon Infinity progresses, the SO gains knowledge of and control over these implants so that by the end of Infinity, he is able to find the right path and stop the W'rkncacter from being released. In this way, he has power over time and space itself. The universe is his "to manipulate, to destroy and rebiuld". [b][i]Now in the quantum moment before the closure, when all become one. One moment left. One point of space and time. I know who you are. You are Destiny.[/b][/i] This describes the last singular moment of the Marathon universe before it closes. Durandal finally gains a complete understanding of the universe and everything in it from beginning to end. The SO is destiny, fate, the final variable that no one can fully comprehend, yet is unquestionably responsible for the path we all take. The SO, in mastering his Jjaro implants, is capable of changing the universe in any way he sees fit to produce any desired result. All that said, there is no direct reference in Infinity's final screen to the Master Chief. There are fundamental differences between the SO and the Master Chief. Foremost among them are that Master Chief does not have Jjaro implants nor was he created from a reanimated corpse. Also, that the SO was capable of escaping the Marathon universe does expressly require that he then exist in a different universe (i.e. the Halo universe). I completely agree that [i][b]metaphorically[/b][/i] the SO and Master Chief are cut from the same mold of the lone, immortal hero. However any connection between the two must remain solely metaphor, as there is no way to prove a direct connection between the two characters and their universes. Therefore the final screen of Marathon Infinity can only be used to describe Master Chief metaphorically and indirectly, if at all. Your entire section entitled "Marathon: Infinity deciphered" did nothing of the sort. If you truly want to see Marathon Infinity deciphered, read all of Mark Levin's entries for Marathon Infinity on the [url=http://marathon.bungie.org/story/volunteersseries.html]MSP's Volunteers Page[/url]. Your metaphor comparing entities in Marathon Infinity to those in reality is interesting, but is again only metaphor. I completely support efforts to compare various characters from different Bungie games under the traditional role of the lone hero. These characters are easy to find in Bungie titles. Some obvious choices include the SO, Master Chief, Sgt. Eddings, and Konoko. Myth characters such as Connacht/Balor and Alric could also be included. However the proper way to do it is to keep the distinct universes separate and site examples from each universe rather than deliberately combining and confusing separate universes.
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    Deleted User

    Deleted User

    10/14/2009 12:32:27 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Agustus [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Wolverfrog I also have aims to become an author. [/quote] ME 3! Everyones was an A hole when they started. Hell Snakie was there when I began. If I remember correctly I cussed him out on his thread. And I didn't give a s*** about spelling and grammar (see how it has improved!).[/quote] I was there too, and that was only a few months ago.
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    Agustus

    Agustus

    10/13/2009 11:15:59 PM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Atomsk A33 Even if Halo and Marathon took place in the same universe (which they do not), the Security Officer could not be the Master Chief because while the MC was fighting the covenant, the SO was aboard the Marathon. It launched in November 16th 2472 and arrived in 2773, well after MC had done his business. He couldn't have been the MC because he was on a long roadtrip. [/quote] Thats the point. The Halo universe and Marathon are not the same story line. There in different universes. And those universes don't share the same "time". Theres also the time paradox effect to take into consideration. If I went back in time I could theoretically hang out wit my self. Be some where else when the other me is doing... anything really.
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