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Destiny

Discuss all things Destiny.
Edited by Pumpkin Booty: 10/20/2014 9:05:20 PM
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Why People Continue To Play Destiny

After a lot of thought, I've stumbled across the answer to why Destiny continues to have 3.2 million players every day, despite the rage and frustration over the broken loot system, and other RNG mechanics. I thought to myself: why do people continue to play despite being trolled by the loot system? Why do people continue to come back to Xûr every week, or beat the raid every week for their shot at loot, only to be disappointed by the endless wave of shards and sunbreakers? Why do legendary and exotic engrams drop armor for random classes? Why are rewards never tailored to your character? Why are they making [i]everything[/i] a dice throw? The answer is now plain as day, and actually quite simple. Bungie is taking advantage of innate human gambling addictions. There are reasons why Bungie continues to make everything RNG-based, despite the [i]obvious[/i] rage coming from the community: This artificially extends the life of the game. There is not enough endgame content to keep players busy from launch until December, when the DLC (disc-locked content) unlocks. If players work hard enough to obtain the loot through a reliable method, they're afraid they won't stick around until the DLC. Why continue to play when you've got everything you've had your sights on, right? Creating three characters still won't last if there are reliable ways of obtaining a certain piece of gear for those who are incredibly dedicated. Moving on to engram rates, they create exotic engrams to drop for random classes because A: they want to encourage people to start new characters (artificial lifespan), and B: they want to keep people coming back to Xûr. Didn't get the weapon/armor you want? Ahh, he might have it next week. But to get the materials to buy it, you've gotta play a bunch before you can buy it, when you have a 5/6 chance of [i]not[/i] getting the armor you want. They are capitalizing on the fact that people have innate gambling addictions, and [i]this[/i] is precisely what keeps people coming back. The RNG in Atheon's teleportation is designed to artificially increase the difficulty of the raid. Instead of creating mechanics that are difficult at first to figure out, they create a mechanic that destroys all forms of strategy and role-filling, as it [i]should[/i] be. The RNG in the Crucible keeps players playing for a shot at loot drops, which is why it's possible to get exotics as rewards, even for the player who goes 1-35 in Clash. Destiny does not reward performance [i]at all[/i]. It simply rewards you for being present at the end of an activity. There is no incentive to perform well. See what I'm talking about? Everywhere there's RNG in the game, there's another example of Bungie capitalizing on the innate addiction to gambling. It's all a slot machine, people, and guess what? [i]They own you.[/i] They own everyone who hasn't realized this yet. They own each and every person who continues to check Xûr every week, hoping that their desired Exotic will be for sale. And this is exactly why the loot system will never, ever, [i]ever[/i] be fixed. There's not enough real content in the game for people to come back to, so they make the entire meta-game a slot machine so that they can rope people into playing their gutted, half-assed, disappointing excuse for what we were promised was going to be a truly engaging experience. I'm on to you, Bungie. I'll be keeping tabs on the development of this game, but you have been exposed now. First it was the Disc Locked Content, then it was the unneeded nerfs, and then it was the RNG mechanics in the Vault of Glass. You may have everyone else fooled, but I smell bullshit. And I smell it [i]strong.[/i] It seems nobody cares about making a truly good game anymore. Not even you. [b]Edit:[/b] There are an [i]astounding[/i] amount of people in here who seem to think that I am complaining about having to work hard to get gear. That is [i]not[/i] what I am talking about. The only way to get to level cap is by rolling a dice in the Vault of Glass week after week. This isn't grinding, nor is this hard work. One could theoretically join in as a 25 just before the Templar is killed and receive raid armor. This is [i]not[/i] how a raid should reward people. There is no hard work where the particular RNG of this loot system is concerned. [b]Edit 2:[/b] [i]Because some people are apparently brain-dead, read this before you post.[/i] [quote]While every MMO has an RNG component to it's loot system, I feel that a loot system where you cannot get endgame gear other than playing a slot machine once a week creates artificial replay value. Leveling up your gear? It takes a while, but you will get there. Buying faction gear? Could take a while, but you will get there. Hypothetical scenario: The greatest Destiny player carries the worst Destiny player through the Vault of Glass every week. Because of this particular system, there is a good chance that the best Destiny player never gets raid armor, which is required to reach level cap, while the worst player acquires all raid armor and an Epilogue. Then Xûr sells him a helmet because the best player carried him through the weekly. See the problem here? People ultimately aren't rewarded for their skill in this game, as they should be. Other MMO's reward one mostly based off of skill and how much time you put into a task. When there is an element of RNG present, it is usually possible to farm the sources of the loot because of this very reason. In Destiny, it is the opposite. Players are locked out of the loot rewards every week after they complete the raid. Even if someone beats the Vault 50 times, it is theoretically possible to never attain appropriate rewards.[/quote]
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  • The problem isn't the RNG loot system, it's the fact that there is so little content that the loot system is [i]all there is in the game[/i]. Hundreds of MMOs have employed the same system, but you know what else they have? Progression. In WoW, you are gearing up to get further and further into a massive raid instance with your guild. In Destiny, most people will clear the raid in one night, on their first try. As fun as VoG was, I'm not about to grind at it with a "chance" at more gear that I don't need(not interested in Hard mode, there is just too low of a skill cap to stand out in this game). At this point loot is all there is. Luckily my friend is footing the bill for this game so I'll probably be back to check out the DLC every quarter, but I do feel bad for the people that bought into this one.

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  • Anyone have proof about how many people are playing a given day? I'd call BS on 3.2 million... The player base from what I've seen and heard has dropped SIGNIFICANTLY.

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    I thought this would be obvious, apparently a lot of people replying to you don't see it.

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  • Mind = blown...jk, op is a -blam!-

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  • Oh I thought there isn't anything to play besides destiny until November.

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  • Loot hasn't mattered to me since I was level 25. I grind bounties, chest runs, materials, and patrol missions for some rep. I don't really care about loot or anything like that. Maybe I'm different, but maybe I'm not.

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  • Okay listen I'm a Destiny white knight and posts like this are intolerable. I don't care if you haters bought this game with your own money. I also don't care that purchasing something gives you the right to "complain" about said purchase. All I care about is how much I love the game. All I care about is how I relate to the game everyone else is just entitled. I got enough out Destiny so you should feel exactly like me because grimoire & ten years. You need to play like me, then the game will have story you entitled brats. [spoiler]Sarcasm.This what you sound like defending this game.GTFO White Knights. [spoiler]

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    7 Replies
    • Congratulations. You figured that a business uses various marketing techniques to promote business. You know what? The probably hired a team whose sole purpose is to figure out how to get and retain players. Shocking. Why don't you go analyze Wal-mart and Costco and post an explanation of how they stay in business too? Blow the whistle on 'em folks! They're making money! The gall! RNG loot system!? Bullshit! Bungie is part of a conspiracy to take over the world!!!! Everybody uses frikin DLC to make money nowadays. It's the thing to do because it doubles and triples income. That's why you can squeeze BF players for 120 instead of 60. They may gripe for a minute, but they'll still shell out. Why should Bungie bow out at one sale? And honestly, RNG is probably the most fair way to do it. That way everyone has their .1% chance of the Exotic drop in their Strike/Crucible match. Your solution is?? the best players get all the good gear with their awesome performance, whereas the poor sucker who has the hand-eye coordination of an inebriated pigeon is doomed to his white and green gear? Good idea. Make sure to keep tabs on the development of this game bro. We.All.Care.

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    • Edited by ColdAtrophy: 10/20/2014 5:01:45 AM
      I play Destiny because it's fun. Lookie there. I didn't need to write ~8 paragraphs born out of teenage angst. EDIT: It pains me to say this, largely because I am not going to edit any of my previous responses, but the first time I read through this, I didn't think that was what the OP was saying at all. Get ready internet because you won't see this very often.[b] I am wrong and completely misinterpreted what OP was trying to say.[/b] I apologize.

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      • You're probably right to be honest but this isn't the first occurrence of RNG. It has appeared in all types of games from borderlands to Pokemon to even FIFA. Not many people that I know dislike borderlands because of it I even have a friend who says he loves it.(tho he may be a gambler lol) as for Pokemon yes people do rage about it on the competitive side of things to the point where some people don't consider battling competitive because of the random factor. But in FIFA on the other hand people empty out their wallets to buy Gold packs to get the player they want. They get mad if they don't succeed but continue to buy when the next paycheck comes around. (That said FIFA does have a trading system in place.) I don't disregard what you are saying by any means it can be frustrating but this game would have died out if this system wasn't in place. Definitely not the first game to do this and I'm sure it won't be the last.

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      • Edited by Dynamo8: 10/20/2014 5:12:11 AM
        Based on Destinys RNG system so far its pretty below average, there are other loot based games that have a far worst RNG than this. At least you get somethin even if it's not what you want. Other MMOs (even though Destiny isn't one) you get nothing or get, "ninja(ed)" as in a party or group member you get jacked from them even if you deal the finishing blow on the boss. Sure you can argue other games like Diablo and Borderlands series but they're solely design to be a singular player experience so you're bound to get something good, Destiny on the other hand is not so there's the balance issue involved. Any loot based game = Gambling It's always been like that, so it's nothing new really. Bungie is just doing what any other loot base game has been doing for awhile.

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        • I just come here for the comments

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        • It has nothing to do with the science of the human brain. I play this game because I enjoy it, it's fun, and I love it a lot.

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        • Stackable Abilities for weapons and armour info _____________________________________ https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/73983410/0/0

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        • A few points of interest... I am a level 29 Hunter and have obtained most of my gear from the raid or from the New Monarchy. With some luck I have obtained weapons from engrams, exotic bounties, and the occasional lucky look from doing the weeklies. Xur is a joke to me. I check his wares to find something I don't have or something that might be useful in the future. Occasionally I see a weapon that just looks cool so I buy it. Every game with a loot system you will ever play will have a gamblers chance at giving you what you actually want. I played Rift for years and the Hammerknell raid (hardest at the time) had 10 bosses (maybe 11) that each dropped different items. You had 20 people that couldn't wear half of the stuff that dropped so it was the luck of the draw. Distribute the loot, come back next week after the reset and try again. One game with an exception that I did play was the original Everquest. The problem people had with this game though was the entire world was open to the thousands of players playing the game. There were no instanced raids, dungeons (until much later), or completely random legendary loot. You had to either work with other guilds and take turns on raids, or camp out certain players to wait for a boss to spawn. A lot of times my guild would set up a couple of raid nights and send out scouts to every raidable boss in the game until we found one to beat. Once that boss was dead you had 7 days or more for him to respawn and no other guild could fight him in between. These bosses did offer guaranteed loot. You knew what items would drop and you usually already established who would get the loot before going in. Oh yeah, and you had to decide between 70+ players in the raid who would get the item... That my friend was a true test to how addicted a game could actually get you because you could play the game for years and still not reach a maximum level of raid gear... If you are relying on the crucible for gear you must not have any friends or raid skills... I play the crucible for 3 reasons: - Legendary upgrade items (usually obtained by collecting crucible marks, buying gear, and tearing it down for the appropriate item---same goes for vanguard marks) - Achievements - Because I enjoy the player vs player side of the game Though I could be wrong, gear can be obtained from the crucible especially for the very lucky few. I strongly believe it was never intended to be a primary source of legendary and exotic gear. It's a place to compete with the other players of the game and test your might so to speak. In closing, you are right. Bungie has set up a system that keeps players intrigued. People want to continuously get better gear, or just horde items like I do (which has proven very useful when I am in need of ascended upgrade items). If you set up a guaranteed method of getting the best gear people would hit it and quit it. Instead we want to become better for future content because I seriously doubt level 26-30 raids is going to be where it ends. Game content will eventually get harder which will require the best gear, and the cycle will start all over again because you will be needing better gear for the next level of challenges they present. It's good business for any game to add a system like this. Now the constant changing of mechanics is something new to me... I could share how aggravated this makes me, but I think enough people including myself have shared their distaste for this latest patch by now so I will leave it at that.

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        • I'm just looking forward to The Last Word. Once I get that, done. (Probably not but still.)

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          I'm still playing Destiny 'cause at the moment, there's nothing else to play. Except for Alien and Evil Within.

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        • Lol interesting ready but -blam!- you, Im coming back to play Destiny because it's fun for me.

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        • Edited by TheHamOfSteel: 10/20/2014 5:03:16 AM
          [quote]Why people continue to play Destiny[/quote] Four words, "carrot", "on", "a", and "stick". [quote]Bungie is taking advantage of innate human gambling addictions. [/quote] I guess this is your first loot based RNG game, isn't it?

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        • The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, and expecting different results. People do the exact same thing, do amazing in crucible, strikes, and etc. Expecting this time I'll get legendary gear. Theres only so little you can do in the game after a while, it just gets tedious.

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        • No I think you are way off.....well for me yeah. I keep playing because I have nothing to play. Why do I have nothing else to play? I have no money to buy a new game. Why don't I have funds? Oh thats right! I bought this damn game and its expansions. Im as big a jackass as Bungie. lol

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        • What does RNG mean? Run N Gun?

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          1 Reply
          • I don't think it has anything to do with a subconscious gambling dependence. I think that Bungie wants to believe that the random loot system adds balance to the game. Which I do not agree with, whatsoever. I agree with everything else you said, though.

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          • i play because i enjoy the combat n the grind. it has the feeling of an old school game and if im lev 21 n only just got to venus after 21hrs of play i have to say im taking my time n loving it. i also high maybe that helps the fun

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          • Maybe WE Enjoy it

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            6 Replies
            • Everything you say is true. However, the base game playing can be addictive. I personally, can see how I will get bored of it, by then the new DLC arrive to keep us hooked. It is just another entertainment product. At the moment, I am happy with it, until something more attractive comes out and make me switch. (and trust me it will, as there are new players popping all the time, hungrier, leaner and willing to take it to the big boys, as Bungie once did with Halo). At the end, the power is with us consumers.

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