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Destiny

Discuss all things Destiny.
Edited by Saxoclone: 12/10/2013 10:07:44 PM
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The proposed chat system will hinder the cooperative spirit of Destiny.

Game Informer released a [url=http://www.gameinformer.com/b/features/archive/2013/12/09/revealing-the-details-of-destinys-competitive-multiplayer.aspx]video interview[/url] today focused on details of Destiny's competitive multiplayer. One of details touched upon in the interview was how in-game chat is going to be handled. It was stated that the in-game chat will by default be restricted to just the fireteam with which you entire a game. For example, if you enter the game with one other friend in your fireteam, they will be the only one you can chat with by default, regardless of how many other people are on your multiplayer team. The purpose of this set-up is to, at least by default, keep your experience the one you have chosen, undisturbed by the ragers, the whiners, and other players you may not want to deal with. Chatting with your other teammates (the other fireteams) will require the use of your platform's own chat functions, like XBL's party chat. Granted, this short interview blurb might not cover the full scope of the chat functions. However, if we were to assume that what was said in the Game Informer interview does indeed cover the extent of how chat functions in Destiny, I believe that this is a very bad idea that will work against Bungie's professed desire to bring teamwork and cooperation to the forefront of Destiny. To begin, I have always viewed the likes of party chat as a double-edged sword. When it was first introduced on Xbox 360, I was extremely excited to finally have a way to talk to a group of only my friends rather than having to listen to some of the unsavory people and conversations that frequently came about in game chat. It was a much more fun and friendly environment to play in. Eventually the people I played and chatted with most started playing less and less. I found myself desiring to go into game chat to perhaps meet some new people to play with, or at least to be able to converse about the game. But I found that no matter what game I played, nearly every lobby I joined was deathly quiet. I personally attribute this to party chat. In general, the people who do still use mics when playing a game are nearly always in party chat. There is no more desire to socialize in public matchmaking--why bother talking with strangers when you can just chat with established friends? Back to the situation of Destiny. I don't take issue with defaulting to fireteam-only chat. What I do find problematic is the idea of having to use the built-in chat functions of XBL or PSN to communicate with players outside your fireteam. Think about all the steps you would need to go through just to chat with the rest of your team (at least for XBL, which I have experience with. PSN may be easier or harder.): bring up the guide menu; start a party chat; invite your own fireteam; find your recent players and determine which of them are currently playing on your team; send all of them invites; and then wait to see if they accept. And because of the nature of Destiny being always connected, this is all happening with the game world occurring around you. On top of that, you would have to create a new party for a new set of players for every single game. That's [i]insane[/i]. [i]No one[/i] is going to want to go through that much work just to chat with people outside their fireteam. At this point, we can't be sure if this applies only to competitive multiplayer or whether it applies to all multiplayer functions throughout Destiny. If the latter were true though, it would make the problem many, many times worse, since all those other multiplayer situations are cooperative and greatly encourage teamwork and socialization. Imagine having to set up party chats every time you entered a public event. The tediousness of the process would kill any sort of cooperation in the game. So my ultimate point about this system: while the goal to keep strangers from ruining your experience by abusing the chat function is admirable, the process be which this is achieved ultimately works completely to the detriment of the cooperative spirit Bungie is trying to foster in Destiny. My proposed solution: have separate "fireteam" and "team" chats available, or if Bungie insists on using each platforms built in chats, at least make the process of creating a team chat streamlined. You can still start players in fireteam chat, but make it easy as a push of a button to start or join a chat with the rest of the team. For example: I enter a matchmade game with my fireteam. I decide I want to chat with the rest of my team. Just as I could easily and quickly bring up the scoreboard and mute a player in Halo, allow me to use one button to quickly and easily switch to an established team chat, or if using XBL or PSN chat, create and send invites for or join a party chat. If I don't want to chat, I can stay in fireteam chat. If I want to chat with the whole team, I can easily switch to team chat. If I then decide I don't like the people I'm chatting with, I can just as easily switch right back to fireteam chat. This allows for the customization of user experience without making the process a hassle, preventing others from being able to ruin your experience without stifling community interaction. TL;DR: [spoiler]Based on the information known at the time of this post, the process of being able to speak with more than the 2 other people in your fireteam is rather arduous, possibly restricting the amount of socialization possible in Destiny. The process just needs to be streamlined so that switching from fireteam to an "all-team chat" (and vice versa) is quick and easy. This will promote socialization while still allowing each player to have an undisturbed experience if they so choose.[/spoiler] Whether or not what I've suggested is possible, I don't know. I'm not professional developer (yet). Not to mention that for all we know right now Bungie might have a solution already (with all the smart cookies up in Bellevue, I think it more than likely). I'm just calling it as I see it with what we do know. If any solution is possible, though, please attempt it. If your goal is to foster cooperation and socialization and the growth of the community in Destiny, the current chat function will only work against it.

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  • I'm fairly antisocial, so this news is perfectly fine with me.

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    • i see what your saying and i respect your opinion. that being said, they are making it so that you can communicate with your team without having to go into chat. i think it will be somewhat similar to battlefield, with preset commands you can give to other players. also, they are designing the game primarily around cooperative, fireteam-based play. strikes and cooperative world-play. beyond that there is the option to go into competitive multiplayer and more intense PvE situations like raids. for multiplayer, you will be playing against other factions with members of your own faction. these could be people you know or people you don't know. the default for this reflects the majority of players choice to either already be in party chat or stay silent (like you mentioned yourself) raids are different. raids are large-scale, continuous PvE combat which will involve creating a team prior to beginning the raid in the first place. that means people will be communicating in platform-based chat functions in order to organize these raids. they wont need team chat. im sure Bungie will take your multiplayer woes into consideration, but it look slike the default setting will keep you from having to worry about whether or not your other team mates know how to act online.

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    • Edited by Commander Tempu: 12/10/2013 9:50:28 PM
      I am glad so when i do not go PVP i do not need to hear annoying voices or people being stupid on there Kenect nor do i need to hear there family life. Not trying to bash but they need a noise filter for that stuff i have to mute them allot of the time. All for family's or people using Kenect just not a fan of the Background noise. Also halo had allot of annoying little kids not to mention adults. I am not talking the usual in game smack talk just annoying sounds or trolls grifers or the like spamming the mic or they have the stereo so loud you can hear it. Besides if you really need to talk to people you join a party on Xbox live. So its not that big of a deal.

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      • I agree with all your points. PSN/XBL chat, & Team and Fireteam chat systems are a great idea if they are separated. If they had to choose something exclusive, the team and obviously the PSN/XBL chat systems would be the best ones to keep built into the game.

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      • The beta will be, among other things, a good test of the proposed chat system. Any flaws in the design or infrastructure will quickly become apparent as larger & larger numbers of testers log on. I think the interview pointed out that the research done thus far by Bungie indicated that the 3-man fireteam is by far the most common grouping of players, which is one of the reasons why it is the default chat. Whether or not that sentiment will survive the onset of the beta remains to be seen. In any event, I agree that channels would be a good idea. That way if I want to mute all the requests being spammed across the Tower for powerleveling or guild recruitment, I can do so. Then again, without knowing what sort of hardware & bandwidth requirements would need to be met in order to support such a setup, I can't honestly say how "easy" or "feasible" such a move would be.

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        • Edited by ZER0: 12/10/2013 9:43:25 PM
          The chat functionality should remain the same as it was in their previous games. Unless some number of players in a team are in private/party chat, by default all players in a team should be able to communicate with each other. The justification they give that there is 1 in 10 chance someone will ruin your ruin your experience is just moronic and speaks of poor design because there is only a 10 percent chance such an incident would occur with a player. If such thing does exist then the tried and true system of muting should be available. The multiplayer portion of the game itself might be one where team work isn't required to defeat a competent opposing team and a greater emphasis on lone-wolfing is placed on players. If such design philosophy is followed, I would be pretty disappointed in the game but it would then make sense why they would restrict chat with other players other than the ones in your fire-team.

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        • Just like how your space ship is really a glorified Pelican I'm sure this will work out just as good.

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        • They should just make communications a function on the options screen so you can filter whatever you want. Would probably be a bitch to code though. Lol

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          • I agree OP

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          • Here is how I see it, you have chat with your fire team and thats great cause speaking with a full server of people would be rather confusing Its not fully about babies crying in mikes, and little kids, and shity mikes, and trolls! But about it being clear who is speaking, without having to go into a private chat setting. Theres nothing to say you cant hear people at all, like if they talk over mike you can hear them if they are nearby, much like halo, were you you can hear your enemys when your close by

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          • 0
            Limiting communication is an absolutely terrible idea and I hope Bungie reads these posts sorry understand.

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            • Play it first.

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              I agree, destiny is supposed to be a "social experience"...... Where you can't talk to other players? Bungie seems too focused on removing the bad without looking at the good they are removing as well. Restricting communication in competitive multiplayer should not ever cross a game developers mind. The whole point of being on a team is to work together. The key to that is communication. If they wanted to restrict communication outside of competitive multiplayer they may be able to conceive a counter argument or two for it. I'm offended they mentioned limiting communication within competitive gameplay.

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              • You want to hear trolls ?,

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              • [quote] Chatting with your other teammates (the other fireteams) will require the use of your platform's own chat functions, like XBL's party chat.[/quote] Only in a campaign setting. In competitive MP the fireteam size is maxed at 6, which I am led to believe is also the max team size. In a competitive game you'll be able to talk to your teammates by default.

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              • In a way it makes Sense.

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              • Edited by jbx: 12/10/2013 6:05:44 AM
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                Lars said there will be other ways of communicating to other teams. As far as I'm concerned, I could care less about talking to other people in fire-teams separate from mine. In a raid, the objective is already more than clear. I'm sure there will be some setting that can enable you to talk to everyone, not just your squad. But hey, let's make bold assertions about a game that none of us have ever played, because, you know, it's different than what we're used to...

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                • 0
                  That's a really long article but going by the title and such I think I agree with you, but I'm sure the final result will leave us satisfied.

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                • Honestly I like this idea. A lot. Im tired of dealing with random little kids in every game screaming their head off every time something changes on their screen.

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                • no one really talks anyway because of Party chat so i dont see a big issue.

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                  • 0
                    What will people do who play solo? Sit on silence and weep if Bungie has their way.

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                    • The impression I got is that there would be a quick and easy way to form a fire team or in-game chat in a quick and easy way without having to form an Xbox LIVE party or PSN equivalent or at least those were the details they were looking into but hadn't finalized yet. From what I gathered they're just making in-game chat an 'opt-in' option with unknown players being muted as the default instead of the opposite it had been before and going from their explanation for their change being to avoid that 1/10th of interactions (more like 1/3 to 1/2 if you ask me) that ruin the game I have to agree with it being the right one.

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                    • Given that the fire team is the default unit formation, it makes sense that it's also the default chat channel as well. Lars' issue with open chat is that it can break immersion if you get the 12 y/o with the f-bomb habit on your chat line. For larger engagements, maybe they'll have Raid channels, or something similar. Always liked how that worked in AoC.

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                    • Hopefully as I have seen others suggest, they have the opposite of the mute button that is in Halo. Instead of pressing x to quick mute a player, you could press x to invite player to fireteam. Maybe the point emote could function similarly when pointed at another player.

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                      • Edited by SquattingTurtle: 12/10/2013 4:56:07 AM
                        Its bad enough no one even has a mic. Now this? What happened to early xbox live where it was weird if you didn't put in your mic and talk. What a way to discourage meeting players.

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