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Destiny

Discuss all things Destiny.
Edited by Pumpkin Booty: 10/20/2014 9:05:20 PM
654

Why People Continue To Play Destiny

After a lot of thought, I've stumbled across the answer to why Destiny continues to have 3.2 million players every day, despite the rage and frustration over the broken loot system, and other RNG mechanics. I thought to myself: why do people continue to play despite being trolled by the loot system? Why do people continue to come back to Xûr every week, or beat the raid every week for their shot at loot, only to be disappointed by the endless wave of shards and sunbreakers? Why do legendary and exotic engrams drop armor for random classes? Why are rewards never tailored to your character? Why are they making [i]everything[/i] a dice throw? The answer is now plain as day, and actually quite simple. Bungie is taking advantage of innate human gambling addictions. There are reasons why Bungie continues to make everything RNG-based, despite the [i]obvious[/i] rage coming from the community: This artificially extends the life of the game. There is not enough endgame content to keep players busy from launch until December, when the DLC (disc-locked content) unlocks. If players work hard enough to obtain the loot through a reliable method, they're afraid they won't stick around until the DLC. Why continue to play when you've got everything you've had your sights on, right? Creating three characters still won't last if there are reliable ways of obtaining a certain piece of gear for those who are incredibly dedicated. Moving on to engram rates, they create exotic engrams to drop for random classes because A: they want to encourage people to start new characters (artificial lifespan), and B: they want to keep people coming back to Xûr. Didn't get the weapon/armor you want? Ahh, he might have it next week. But to get the materials to buy it, you've gotta play a bunch before you can buy it, when you have a 5/6 chance of [i]not[/i] getting the armor you want. They are capitalizing on the fact that people have innate gambling addictions, and [i]this[/i] is precisely what keeps people coming back. The RNG in Atheon's teleportation is designed to artificially increase the difficulty of the raid. Instead of creating mechanics that are difficult at first to figure out, they create a mechanic that destroys all forms of strategy and role-filling, as it [i]should[/i] be. The RNG in the Crucible keeps players playing for a shot at loot drops, which is why it's possible to get exotics as rewards, even for the player who goes 1-35 in Clash. Destiny does not reward performance [i]at all[/i]. It simply rewards you for being present at the end of an activity. There is no incentive to perform well. See what I'm talking about? Everywhere there's RNG in the game, there's another example of Bungie capitalizing on the innate addiction to gambling. It's all a slot machine, people, and guess what? [i]They own you.[/i] They own everyone who hasn't realized this yet. They own each and every person who continues to check Xûr every week, hoping that their desired Exotic will be for sale. And this is exactly why the loot system will never, ever, [i]ever[/i] be fixed. There's not enough real content in the game for people to come back to, so they make the entire meta-game a slot machine so that they can rope people into playing their gutted, half-assed, disappointing excuse for what we were promised was going to be a truly engaging experience. I'm on to you, Bungie. I'll be keeping tabs on the development of this game, but you have been exposed now. First it was the Disc Locked Content, then it was the unneeded nerfs, and then it was the RNG mechanics in the Vault of Glass. You may have everyone else fooled, but I smell bullshit. And I smell it [i]strong.[/i] It seems nobody cares about making a truly good game anymore. Not even you. [b]Edit:[/b] There are an [i]astounding[/i] amount of people in here who seem to think that I am complaining about having to work hard to get gear. That is [i]not[/i] what I am talking about. The only way to get to level cap is by rolling a dice in the Vault of Glass week after week. This isn't grinding, nor is this hard work. One could theoretically join in as a 25 just before the Templar is killed and receive raid armor. This is [i]not[/i] how a raid should reward people. There is no hard work where the particular RNG of this loot system is concerned. [b]Edit 2:[/b] [i]Because some people are apparently brain-dead, read this before you post.[/i] [quote]While every MMO has an RNG component to it's loot system, I feel that a loot system where you cannot get endgame gear other than playing a slot machine once a week creates artificial replay value. Leveling up your gear? It takes a while, but you will get there. Buying faction gear? Could take a while, but you will get there. Hypothetical scenario: The greatest Destiny player carries the worst Destiny player through the Vault of Glass every week. Because of this particular system, there is a good chance that the best Destiny player never gets raid armor, which is required to reach level cap, while the worst player acquires all raid armor and an Epilogue. Then Xûr sells him a helmet because the best player carried him through the weekly. See the problem here? People ultimately aren't rewarded for their skill in this game, as they should be. Other MMO's reward one mostly based off of skill and how much time you put into a task. When there is an element of RNG present, it is usually possible to farm the sources of the loot because of this very reason. In Destiny, it is the opposite. Players are locked out of the loot rewards every week after they complete the raid. Even if someone beats the Vault 50 times, it is theoretically possible to never attain appropriate rewards.[/quote]
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  • I keep playing because I enjoy f*cking around on it? Regularly bottom of PvP, will never attempt the VoG or Hard Raids etc. Yet, I keep playing. Small things. Actually killing someone in PvP! A long range head shot on a Fallen, even if it is a Lvl 2. Small enjoyments. That's why I keep playing

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    • Edited by AfterF: 10/22/2014 9:27:05 AM
      Why is this a surprise? It's the whole concept of RNG. Pretty much the joy of MMO's in the first place. When you get that piece of gear you've been waiting for. It's a great feeling and makes it all worthwhile.

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    • I've spent the past hour driving circles around Venus in a pike. I've helped 6 raid groups so far get into the vault and have come across 3 public events. Never got off the pike once since I got on it. Probably the most fun I've had since I got the game.

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    • You are spot on!! "CONTINGENCIES AND SCHEDULES To keep lab rats interested in food and extend the supply of food on hand they limit giving food to the rat to certain circumstances, instead of every time he does what he's supposed to do to get food. You can see this being used in Destiny's reward and loot system. It also mentions giving random power ups which can be related to PvP Heavy Weapon Ammo drops, and how your guaranteed one super in an match without doing good RATIOS AND INTERVALS Talks about two different contingencies, fixed ratios schedules and interval variable schedules. Fixed Ratio- Is a very distinct pattern that gives a burst of activities to do at a time but then followed by a long pause. For example, in RPG you try to level up by gaining experience but once you hit the new level you have to go get more experience to try to get to the next level. The "pause" is what keeps you wanting to push forward into the game, but if a "pause" is too long players will walk away. Some long pauses can be positive if it makes the gamer concentrate on another game feature that could get them hooked on. This can be related to having factions to level up to reach a high enough level to buy certain items from that faction. Leveling up new weapons and gear can create this burst of activity of trying to work your way up to unlock new mods. Everybody can relate to this long "pause" in Destiny, and I think they had a goal with it to get you start a new character where you literally restart the cycle that will keep giving you stuff to grind towards. Variable Ratio Schedules- Is a set limit to reach before being rewarded but the limit is different everytime. The limit will be randomly generated each time and the gamer will not know the set limit before the next reward. This encourages gamers to play knowing they have a chance for good reward with the mystery of when and what you could possibly be rewarded. This could be a possible relation to how the cryptarch decrypted engrams before patch 1.02. But this is the reason we do raids, strikes, and daily/weekly activites. SPECIAL CASES This goes on to explain other less common theories to game addiction that can be effective if used in the right way. Chain Schedules- Activities that have multiple stages that normally have form of puzzles and timed based enemies. This is 100% talking about the idea mechanics of the raids. Extinction- Game mechanics built in to gradually reduce a spawn in the game after every time it is received or killed. This results to eventually receiving nothing and/or enemies stop spawning in. I could be wrong but the only thing I can think of in Destiny that is similar to this is the invisible ascendant material limit for completing Public Events. At some point you won't receive anyhting but glimmer after so many public events. I haven't figured out if its weekly, daily, or planet based. Avoidance- is where the objective is to do something so that something negative won't happen. He uses his evidence with lab mice to prove this will keep you doing something. The example is where the mice were "shocked every so often" but the shock would be delayed for 30 seconds if they pressed a lever. There might be more places in the game where this is used but the only ones I'm coming up with are the raid. The beginning you hold pillars and avoid Minotaurs from coming in because it will stop the forming of the tower, you also have a similar concept on the first boss where you can't let them sacrifice. Lastly, we shoot the oracles to prevent being marked for a time initiated instadeath(very similar to the rat test). HOW TO MAKE PLAYERS PLAY HARD Here is where he brings in all of his theories on "what makes us want more in a game". He pretty much says the game needs to have his theorized aspects all tied into the game in the right amount of proportions. HOW TO MAKE PLAYERS PLAY FOREVER Here he says games need to always have something new for the player to do and have a consistent rewards with constant probabilities. I have read other articles that have bashed his article years ago. That makes me wonder if the arcticle was editted with rewording or removed some of the content since its original posting. Because in his post in 2012(http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/172409/10_years_of_behavioral_game_design_.php) he seems to have alot of influence by bungie to give a explanation from a post 10 years ago. Let me know what y'all think of this. I know its pretty much old news but I doubt anybody had actually seen a detailed description on how to make you addicted to a game and then that same person 13 years later releases a game built upon his core principles."

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      • Like other people have said Destiny only has that many players right now because it is the only half decent new game out. Right once MCC and COD AW come out you can wave good bye to half of Destiny's population. Then once the DLC is disappointing you can wave by to another 10%.

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      • Look pal, many people including myself have this figured out. News flash: We don't care. We enjoy the game just like is enjoy playing blackjack at a casino. I've had way more fun and spent way less money on Destiny compared to my last real gambling session though. Bro, you're not that smart. You haven't figured out the meaning of life here. Just take a look at candy crush saga or any other video game, and it's easy to see all games dangle the carrot in different ways.

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        • Edited by London Lost Boy: 10/21/2014 9:39:33 PM
          I love this game!! My favorite level is the start up screen; played it hundreds of times tonight and farmed a few legendary animal engrams all night tonight. Cynisism aside, I can't wait until all 3 chars are levelled up and ready for the DLC. I knew what I was committing to, the same as Fable 2 all those years ago. Now just fix those -blam!-ing dogshit servers and leg me go back to enjoying the game!

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        • OR.... they accualy like playing it and they're not some hater who downloaded and kept the destiny app -_-

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        • Also I bought a ps4 just for this game, I resorted to buying battlefield 4 just so I had a reason to use it because I can't stomach playing Destiny more than a day or two per week.

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        • i dont care about rewards, levels etc. i play purely for fun because... it is a game. if u arent having fun then maybe u need to choose a different pastime cos games are meant to be fun. who cares about virtual rewards? not me cos i play for fun. if it wasnt fun id stop playing, its that simple. im just having fun, then some more fun & then a whole lot more fun.

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        • Why do you care what anyone else does? Are you playing the game for them?

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        • Because I am having fun with my friends in it? Shocking concept these days. I know.

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        • Very well written! And I say I agree on every point.

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        • The reason why we all play destiny is because there is no great game out. People bought destiny and got bored of their cod/Bf/singleplayer game. All games release in november-december for the holidays. That is exacly the reason why people play destiny. Gameplay is great, but it feels like a single player game. Finish it and get bored.

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        • Bump

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        • Yeah dude. Bungie is a bunch of bad peoples who wants our money's and have no passion about their game that they put so much of their personal time into. Bunch of shade balls right? Here is what I know, and it's very simple. Destiny is FUN. I enjoy playing it. I enjoy helping my fellow guardians when they need help on a strike, raid, collecting an exotic bounty and so forth. That's what I like. I've met some great people on here and will continue to play this game for a long time. Crazy right?!

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        • Seems like a good conspiracy theory

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          • So what you're saying is I'm addicted? Already know doe

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          • Everything you've said is true. Here is my personal experience. SCENARIO 1 Struggling with Atheon on Hard & 1 man short. After sending out a flurry of invites, a friend joins. Thank God, a sixth man. But as soon as he spawns in the game, we defeat Atheon......... and BOOM!!...... He is rewarded with the Vex Mythoclast while the others that had struggled for the past 4 hrs enjoy their 7th piece of precious, oh so precious Chatterwhite. SCENARIO 2 A friend of mine has faithfully played this terribly assembled game week after week; completing bounties, daily stories, nightfall and weekly strikes. He finishes the Raid on both Normal & Hard every week but has somehow only managed to receive only one piece of Legendary Raid Gauntlets for his Hunter. So he optimistically creates another character, another [i][b]HUNTER[/b][/i], to try and increase his odds for obtaining Hunter specific gear. But playing Destiny is indeed a gamble, and luck has not favored this particular friend of mine. As he prays for a Raid Chest Plate, Raid Boots, Raid Helmet, HELL I'm sure he'd be happy with just a Raid Cloak at this point, he receives Ascendant Energy at the end of his dice roll. He rolls the dice again with his other Hunter..... Ascendant Shards. Don't get me wrong, he does get SOME awesome stuff. He's got the Timebreaker Sparrow, which is pretty sweet. And precious, oh so precious Chatterwhite. I honestly don't know if he'll continue playing this game if he gambles in the VoG again this week with his TWO hunters only to be disappointed again. A number of people purchased Destiny because of it's potential to become Legend. Bungie created this game because they saw the potential for this game to become Legend. Bungie HAS the OPPORTUNITY to make this game Legend.. They have to make very careful decisions as they move towards achieving that status. Sadly their past slew of decisions have been in the completely opposite direction.

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            • Every game nowadays uses the phsychology of addiction, timed reward systems and RNG to get people hooked. They pay huge salaries to phsycologist that specialize in the field to assist with game design Problem is that bungie went to extremes and you can see it at every turn. To the point that it is making people realize they are being played and starting to upset them. I would bet a huge chunk of the developement money for this game went into research on how to " addict" people to this game. It seems so blatant, like the game was built around those reward systems and everything else was an afterthought

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              • You sure put a lot of effort into this piece of shit post. Lol #tryagain

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                • This actually does make sense. No matter how much hate we put into it, we still come running back when we have another chance.

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                • Beat the RNG by sending your clan in with people who have already completed that week. We do 3 eligible 3 ineligible so the 3 eligible have a greater chance at the best drops. It has been working for us. If only 3 members can get drops, they end up getting better stuff and its more concentrated.

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                  • HELLLL NO, gambling my ass, its peoples addictive drive to have that new shit not many people have and to kick as much ass as possible with it, show it off etc. these gaming designers just fail time to time and come out with some gear that looks stupid, that should be number one priority how the god damn gear looks, and it better be bad ass

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                    • There is one way to beat the RNG in the raid. You have to do it with a group who has already completed it for the week. We split our clan up into little groups and never have more than 3 people eligible for rewards. That way, the 3 that can get stiff have a greater chance at gear. This works. We have significantly improved our drops.

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                    • I agree to an extent but aren't nearly all mmorpgs this way-_- u ppl need to lay of destiny it's a good game loot system is not broken(needs tweeking in a few places overall nothing wrong) it's practically the same in all the mmos I give u an example diablo/order and chaos is basically the same as destiny u grind u find loot that's not for your specific class get the -blam!- over this shit man also loot is super -blam!-ing random in every other mmo u Freakn play I agree it does need a tweek here and there but nothing is really broken Except glitches where u find them xD and other stuff I won't talk about

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