Nah people are jumping at this before the games even launched or before raids have actually happened. Is it going to be truly hard for people to make new friends in this game for raids.?

I know we've had our differences in the past, but this was actually well thought out. Like I've mentioned in prior posts, so long as it doesn't affect me or the players that I play with... what's the big deal? I can see one aspect where the casual player base DOES get frustrated and calls for the nerf hammer, but also see it as a helpful tool to motivate them to make friends to one day conquer these challenging raids. I'm not too sure if I'm completely sold on denying them access or penalizing them because they don't have the minimum amount of friends. IMO if Bungie sticks to their guns and let's them know, there's a high chance of failure by pugging... at least they don't have high expectations going in. The worst that could happen is they make a few friends on the way, and they can work out some strategies for a later attempt.

Let's settle this? What are you going to do? Make a larger army size version of the Final Valley battle in Naruto?

Good post, but I disagree. First, MM has been around for ages - at least since Halo 2 (2004). And if H2 was the origin, then Bungie itself created it. Either way, Bungie has crafted the most even matches I've ever played. I rarely, if ever had hugely lopsided experiences in Halo, whereas it happened frequently in COD or Battlefield. So to factor for skill (kpm, k/d, revives per teammate death, dps, etc, etc, etc) is fairly simple. Obviously those things aren't perfect, but skill factors are fairly obvious, and with such a large population, Bungie can easily get a norm to reference and tweak. On top of that, reputations systems and reporting/feedback systems have been around for almost as long. What's an individual's raid quit percentage? What rating does the guardian have from all of the fireteams he's been on? Second, Bungie isn't preventing bad people from playing. Baddies will get with their bad friends and have a very frustrating time. Just because a group of friends are playing together doesn't mean anything. Bad players have bad friends. "Not necessarily," you may say. Well, if they have good friends, then they'll end up getting carried, which is another argument I've heard against MM. People will get carried with MM. Maybe. But how does making people go with friends change any of this? The only thing it potentially prevents is a good player getting an unwanted bad player on their team, as they can choose who to play with and who not to play with. But if a good player is using MM anyway, it's probably because he doesn't have any friends to play with at the time and just wants to play. People know the risks going in. The reason people take risks is because the potential reward is worth it to them. But if a decent MM system is implemented, the risk shouldn't even be that high. Third, every boss so far has been cake. The AI is mindless and the bosses can't hit you because there are immune locations on all the boss fight maps. Sure, Bungie might make things tough. Halo on Legendary was very tough solo, and even with 2 people. But it wasn't hard at all with 4. I'm sure Bungie could go bigger and badder, but I have yet to see a game that is as difficult as Bungie is making this out to be. I'm not saying it won't be, but no evidence I have points to it actually being that hard. Fourth, even if it was that hard, how are people supposed to get good enough to do the raids if they can't play them. None of the AI so far would do anything for practice if the raids end up being so drastically different. Why take the ability for some to play raids because you think it's too hard for them? You left the opportunity to play solo legendary and turn on all skulls in Halo. Why didn't you disable that in Halo 3 unless you first reached rank 50 in MP? It just doesn't make sense to cut people off from a system that is easily implemented and has been done so for decades. Finally, why should people have to hurdle the very game that is touted as the new social game just to get social? They can't talk to anyone and either have to cumbersomely go into their menus and message people, wait for a reply, message back - or join fireteam if it's empty. Or they have to actually go away from the game and find a forum to meet up with people, hoping that these people actually show up, and that they show up when they say they will. I can't tell you how many issues I had doing this very thing trying to beat Halo 3 co-op, get achievements, etc. It can be very difficult to meet up with a group of people, and it can be very time consuming. A lot of people have lives. I just had my first kid back in June. My friend is a teacher and they just had their first kid. He doesn't even have an xbox 1 yet because he's a teacher (like me), and he didn't win his x1 from Mt. Dew (like I was fortunate enough to do). So in terms of finances and time, a lot of my friends from the old xbox days are out. And the one friend I have who did make the jump is a lawyer, has a wife, and what little time he does get to play often doesn't overlap with when I can play. So now what I'm forced to do is go to a forum, spam the refresh button, hope 5 people respond in the 3 hour block I was fortunate enough to carve out, and get a raid game completed that Bungie says may take hours to finish. Well, a third of my time was wasted on the forums. Thanks. I love Bungie and have been around since CE. But while I love them and I've loved Destiny, I don't have a problem speaking out against things I think are flaws. Foregoing what is a generic component of most games (especially "social," online games) and treating it like a vestigal organ or cumbersome accouterments is ludicrous. I haven't seen one argument for it that I think holds any water. They all seem to fall apart because either the exact same thing can occur when friends get together, or the issues with not implementing it are far weightier than the proposed problems with its implementation. I look forward to hearing your reply. I would love to see how I'm wrong so I can support the decision it seems Bungie is pretty adamant about.

The ones of you saying no to MM have nothing to back up why you say no. Just gives people the option to MM and make it so Raids can be done by all. Destiny was not made for only 1000 people it was made for millions. So let the Millions of people play the ENTIRE game. Thanks.

I need matchmaking. Its easy for someone with 15 friends to not care about the rest of us but... No matchmaking is a killer. the chances of me having that many friends online at the same time, all wanting to do the time-invest at the same time, is slim to none. I am then forced to troll the internet for strangers to raid with, whereas I would be better off letting bungie match me and a buddy with people that play like us (which gives me the opportunity for making new same-playstyle friends, yay!). The way it is set now leaves me outside a part of the game I will really want to experience. If this is a social game, then help me make friends.... don't hope I have 5 friends with the same exact life schedule or leave me losing playtime while begging strangers on the internet. Don't put up a wall blocking me because I haven't got 15 clanmates online at the same time, willing to spend 2 hours on a raid. This is the one thing that really kind of leaves a sour taste. I hope they reconsider. I have plenty of PS friends but rounding up more than 3 or 4 would take a miracle... I will need the assistance of matchmaking to make it possible (and possible for those 1 or 2 other players getting matched with me and my friends) I do not see the downside despite the well written opening comment. MM does not affect those that do not need it, but quarrantines that part of the game from those that do need it. Consider this also... If I have 4 friends playing... I cant have a striketeam (3 player max)... but with matchmaking I can at least do a raid with my friends so we are playing together. Right now.. friend number 4 is SOL.

No MM. We need a party finder. We do the work to find our team. Just like here. BUT IN THE GAME. A board in the tower. Just like the bounty board. When you are short friends to raid, or anything else, you make a post. It would be seen server/ area wide. You would have to walk up to it to read it. It's not part of the forum. Players on your system/server who read it can join your party. Voice chat, or proxy then starts. You plan, and go. This can be used for all sorts of parties. Farming, speed runs, Exploring. You can be specific. Experience a must, gear will be checked, no scrubs. I have seen this work. No MM needed.

All the bungi fan boys with hope of their dick once they can't play a raid when they want and others can't. Or realize making a group on this form or in tower is absoktely no dif then random mm. Retard team

"Let's settle this!... With thread number 236 that Bungie will ignore because it's pointless!"

Hi

If it wasn't bad enough with the past two weeks of people spamming beta carry over post now it goi. To be four weeks of raid matchmaking. My answer is NO. All the reasons bungie posted/said pretty much sums it up for me. They also make the most sense. Everyone that wants quick action with decent loot go "strikes". Everyone that has five friends, time, skill, and strategy can go do raids that will give better loot, but will be more of a challenger simple as that.

I agree about there being no matchmaking, it makes perfect, logical sense. Just have an option of a Fireteam of 3 friends, then there's a compromise for everyone. Plus, the whole raid would be harder with less people, so the problem of them becoming too easy simply doesn't exist. What does exist though: raids have just gotten WAY more accessible for casual gamers.

It's a game mode, it needs matchmaking, if it doesn't have matchmaking it better have an in game area to go and meet people for raids... I shouldn't have to go to a forum just to get a team together, there needs to be an IN GAME OPTION. matchmaking is simply the easiest / most obvious.

This has already been settled by Bungie. MM isnt happening lol and im glad you understand that.

The reason I want no mm in destiny is pretty simple. The biggest complaint I see around the forums is as such, "every part of Destiny needs to be accessible to everyone because we all pay the $60 price tag" my reaction? It's already accessible to every one so why does mm need to be involved? Most common replies; "I don't have five friends to them with and I'm not the only one", "getting on the forums is to much work I just want to get in and go", "I don't have time to sit around and wait to do raids I gots a life man!", or another big one "I shouldn't have to use a third party option just to play a game" simply put you are either lazy or looking for a quick action fix and raiding really isn't meant for you any way. Let me explain before you freak out, I understand not having any friends to raid with, I have one friend on ps4 one, where will I find the other four people I need? Well either in game or on here (come on I can't be the only one who's ever made a friend playing a halo game :P), the bungie forums are a huge group of people all interested in the same thing, they call us their community and as such we should act like one, and make nice. Simply put if getting on the forums is to much work or you just want to get in and go? You won't like raiding any way, why? Because with out plans and hard work you won't go any where, you are a lazy gamer and lazy gamers don't do well in games like that. The whole I got a life thing? Pffft okay let me tell you something, I'm 19 now my dad(the one who got me into raiding and challenging games), who raised four kids, kept my mom relatively happy, did things around the house like fix shit, worked two jobs, and enjoyed doing out door activities, was a top of the line raider in vanilla World of Warcraft, which in vanilla just getting to the level cap was worth a server wide party. He obtained his tear gear from every raid at time and even had a max rank in PvP, no it didn't happen over night but he was with a group of 39 other casuals who just met up in the game and set a time to meet up, low and behold it worked. So you might only have 3-5 hours a week to raid but if you do some one else has the same issue, find people who work with your schedule and build a team with them, if my dad could do a 40 man you can do a 6 man. And lastly the third party function, see raiding is most commonly pulled from MMOs, MMOs which allow you to openly talk to thousands of people all at once via a text box. Destiny is not an mmo, so how will it connect you to millions of people all at the same time via a text box? You got it right here, it's simple in a way destiny is fundamentally flawed in the sense that it lacks this option in game due to how how designed. I'm sorry but being to lazy to get on these forums and just talk to people makes you a lazy gamer and you probably won't enjoy raiding any way. So why do I think mm shouldn't be involved? Because it's not needed and not having it acts as a way to weed out those who would other wise won't enjoy it, and mm would most likely lead to nerfing which let's be honest sucks.