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#Halo

FallenLegend

FallenLegend

12/3/2012 4:31:20 AM
I mean as a story. On the surface it seemd as another "rescue the world" tale but I think it had much more. I only got the theme of being human and of the masterchief getting his humanity back a theme that has continued from reach. What do you think the themes of this game were?
  • fez479

    fez479

    12/11/2012 5:10:59 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Hongu Please note: This is directed towards fez479's comment on the first page. I'm new, and sort of a noob, and I don't really know how to reply to other's messages, so just pretend this is a reply to his post. I don't understand how you can compare Halo 4 to Call of Duty. It seems like you're just searching for some asinine reason to hate on Halo 4 and 343i, but I'll hear you out. Let's go over some features in the multiplayer that many tote around as 'plagiarizing' Call of Duty, shall we? 1. Sprinting - This is an extremely common practice nowadays in video games. The fact that some people still claim this as as knock-off of Call of Duty is just fishing for some excuse to latch onto. 2. Pointstreaks - Okay, I will admit, there is some slight similarities here, but it is extremely minor. Once again, rewarding players for kills and performance is quite a common feature in many shooters nowadays. The rewards and system themselves aren't too similar either. In Call of Duty, you pick a certain Killstreak reward for a certain amount of kills. In Halo 4, your ordinance randomly appears after a few successful kills, and you get the chance to obtain weapons or power-ups. Not many similarities there. 3. 'Perks' - The fact that people even dare to call these perks is ignorant. Yes, any feature that gives your character a certain customizable ability must be a knockoff of Call of Duty! Because they were totally the first to practice this, and Halo was definitely the first to 'copy' it. None of them are even similar, the only I can think of is having two primary weapons. 4. - Loadouts - Still not getting you here. Many games, even before Call of Duty, have granted the ability to freely choose certain weapons and equipment to your liking. 5. - Armor Abilities - No, not even close. Nothing, I mean NOTHING about Armor Abilities even come close to resembling Call of Duty. Seriously, I don't understand. ...That's all I can think of at the moment. Gun camos also come to mind, but whoever complains about that I really do not understand. But I DO see where you are coming from. The gameplay generally feels faster paced, more intense, a bit reminiscent of Call of Duty. Halo has been known to take things a bit slower, and I understand how the sudden evolution of gameplay can leave some devoted fans scratching their heads. Most modern first-person-shooters play similar to Halo, and, yes, Call of Duty. In general, the FPS is a tired genre that is slowly running out of ideas. The fact that most developers have exhausted every feature they can think of isn't too surprising, and the fact that Halo 4 has joined the practice shouldn't be either. Also, get this. Most likely, many of the reasons you probably think Halo 4 is ripping off of Call of Duty, BUNGIE HAD INTRODUCED TO HALO PRIOR. So simply putting the blame on 343i really makes you show your true colors. But who knows, maybe I could be wrong. I mean, I wasn't even here when Halo: Reach was released, so I don't know your opinion on that game. Please don't take this as a threat or me attacking you, I'm simply stating how I disagree with your claims. [/quote] I'd like to start out by saying that I really liked 343 before any information came out about Halo 4. They stepped in and did what Bungie refused to do: patch the game, and fixed of my major qualm about Reach (more on my thoughts on Reach later), which was Armor Lock. I was very excited about Halo 4, and sadly all that excitement turned into anger as soon as the first info about Halo 4 came out. Now onto your numbered arguments: 1. I have to admit that I kinda like Sprint. It's turned Halo 4 into a much faster paced game, which it seems to have needed. That's one thing I'll say I can't complain about Halo 4: the base gameplay. Most of it I very much like (hate that the AR is so good, though. Just another example of Halo 4 ruining competitive play and moving towards CoD). 2. The killstreaks are one of the major Call of Duty elements that have been added into the game, and I would really like Halo to do without them. It just adds a viable camping aspect to the game as well as kinda disrupts the balance between those who own the power weapons and those who don't, either making it harder for you to come back or easier to lone wolf it. Not teamplay. Not fun. Not Halo. 3. I find it really interesting that you think that perks are okay because this is actually the #1 reason why I refuse to get this game. I can't even believe that you refuse to admit that any of these perks are similar when every single one is (Dexterity = Sleight of Hand, Shielding = Juggernaut, Mobility = Marathon, Firepower = Overkill, Resupply(something they SPECIFICALLY added into the game) = Scavenger, Grenadier = Extra Pockets, Ammo = Bandolier, Explosives = Danger Close, Wetworks = Dead Silence, Ordinance Priority = Hardline). Perks make the game so random that it just adds tons frustration and wtf moments, and are also quite unbalanced. To say that perks aren't CoD because every game uses them now is absurd. Every game uses perks because they want to be like CoD! I don't want Halo to be like CoD. I want it to stop using perks. I want Halo to not have random and unbalanced gameplay, and perks are the main offender. Gameplay customization is often (Tribes does well) the culprit for unbalanced, unable-to-be-competitive gameplay. 4. I don't think you get what I'm saying. I don't care who made these crappy game mechanics. Call of Duty popularized them so I'll refer to them as CoD mechanics. The fact of the matter is that they suck. They don't work. They ruin gameplay. This game tried to make the customization balanced, but they were stupid and added the Lightrifle (kills in 3 shots to head compared to BR/DMR's 5 and shoots just as fast) and the Plasma Grenade (always has been better than Frag and still is) to the mix, creating obvious potential for imbalance. 5. Eh. I don't really think that Armor Abilities are too CoD-ey (neither do I think I said that...), but they can be annoying. I'd rather just everyone have a Jetpack/Thruster Pack. It certainly makes the game imbalanced when you take into account the ranking system, which queues me to talk about some of the other CoD mechanics in the game. Extras: 6. Ranking system. Now Reach had a crappy ranking system like this before, but it didn't affect gameplay, and now it does. You are forced to not have an AA besides the preset class (Hologram), and those who play the game more than you can use the Lightrifle and Plasma Grenades. Sounds balanced, and fun. 7. Points system. There's no reason why Halo moved from 1 point a kill to 10 points a kill besides to be more like CoD. Not to mention that nowadays you get more points for stylized kills, which ruins the game. I want to win because we killed them more, not because we stuck them more. 8. Spartan Ops. C'mon, they didn't even change the name of this crap. This is just Spec Ops with a story. Now obviously you don't know much about Halo because Halo was always very fast paced until very recently when Reach and, to and extent kinda maybe, Halo 3 came out. I will definitely say that the FPS genre is in no way finished because it's not that it is running out of ideas, but that EVERYONE KEEPS DOING THE SAME IDEA: Call Of -blam!- Duty. There are some very original ideas out there (Tribes for example is completely different than any FPS game, though not a new game of course, and hopefully Destiny will be very original). I want to talk a little bit about why I liked Reach and not Halo 4. Reach was a strategic game. Pros hated it because it kinda screwed with marksmanship, but they were a bit too stubborn. I liked Reach because the default settings (AR, Magnum) were very marksmanship oriented and allowed for a lot of strategic planning with AAs. The magnum could outshoot an AR in ANY situation if you were a good shot, and I have always loved the magnum (since Halo CE). That's why I liked Reach. P.S. Don't pretend like your obvious passive aggressive attitude isn't disrespectful/clearly an attack. [Edited on 12.10.2012 9:24 PM PST]
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  • Myth of Tyrant
  • Hongu

    Hongu

    12/11/2012 3:24:31 AM Permalink
    Please note: This is directed towards fez479's comment on the first page. I'm new, and sort of a noob, and I don't really know how to reply to other's messages, so just pretend this is a reply to his post. I don't understand how you can compare Halo 4 to Call of Duty. It seems like you're just searching for some asinine reason to hate on Halo 4 and 343i, but I'll hear you out. Let's go over some features in the multiplayer that many tote around as 'plagiarizing' Call of Duty, shall we? 1. Sprinting - This is an extremely common practice nowadays in video games. The fact that some people still claim this as as knock-off of Call of Duty is just fishing for some excuse to latch onto. 2. Pointstreaks - Okay, I will admit, there is some slight similarities here, but it is extremely minor. Once again, rewarding players for kills and performance is quite a common feature in many shooters nowadays. The rewards and system themselves aren't too similar either. In Call of Duty, you pick a certain Killstreak reward for a certain amount of kills. In Halo 4, your ordinance randomly appears after a few successful kills, and you get the chance to obtain weapons or power-ups. Not many similarities there. 3. 'Perks' - The fact that people even dare to call these perks is ignorant. Yes, any feature that gives your character a certain customizable ability must be a knockoff of Call of Duty! Because they were totally the first to practice this, and Halo was definitely the first to 'copy' it. None of them are even similar, the only I can think of is having two primary weapons. 4. - Loadouts - Still not getting you here. Many games, even before Call of Duty, have granted the ability to freely choose certain weapons and equipment to your liking. 5. - Armor Abilities - No, not even close. Nothing, I mean NOTHING about Armor Abilities even come close to resembling Call of Duty. Seriously, I don't understand. ...That's all I can think of at the moment. Gun camos also come to mind, but whoever complains about that I really do not understand. But I DO see where you are coming from. The gameplay generally feels faster paced, more intense, a bit reminiscent of Call of Duty. Halo has been known to take things a bit slower, and I understand how the sudden evolution of gameplay can leave some devoted fans scratching their heads. Most modern first-person-shooters play similar to Halo, and, yes, Call of Duty. In general, the FPS is a tired genre that is slowly running out of ideas. The fact that most developers have exhausted every feature they can think of isn't too surprising, and the fact that Halo 4 has joined the practice shouldn't be either. Also, get this. Most likely, many of the reasons you probably think Halo 4 is ripping off of Call of Duty, BUNGIE HAD INTRODUCED TO HALO PRIOR. So simply putting the blame on 343i really makes you show your true colors. But who knows, maybe I could be wrong. I mean, I wasn't even here when Halo: Reach was released, so I don't know your opinion on that game. Please don't take this as a threat or me attacking you, I'm simply stating how I disagree with your claims. [Edited on 12.10.2012 7:30 PM PST]
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  • AlkkaPWN

    AlkkaPWN

    12/10/2012 3:19:58 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] BlackKnightKanos Since this is turning into an "I hate Halo 4" thread. I'll answer this one seriously. I would say that Halo 4 is about triumphing even in defeat. Master Chief's whole journey in Halo 4 has been nothing but countless defeats. He loses Cortana, his contributions are not acknowledged by Infinity, he failed to save the people in the Ivanoff Research Station. Lastly, all the civilians of New Phoenix were composed and he had to destroy the Composer. In turn, killing all the civilians that became digital AIs. It's about what you're willing to do for a cause. How far are you willing to go for a cause.[/quote] This was pretty prevalent to me. It was unusual for John to lose, and above everything else entirely, to lose Cortana (apparently). I think this would fit in as an effect with the motif of John's aging. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] xAT 117x I personally think the the theme was Man (humanity) vs Machine. As Cortana becomes increasingly rampant she becomes increasingly human, and in contrast the Chief has to become more machine like and hide his emotions (more than he usually does) to make sure they both don't fall apart. At the end you're not meant to be sure whether Cortana's "death" has brought Chief back to his humanity or pushed him completely over the edge into machine territory. That is what I got from it anyway...[/quote] I felt this was the main theme. I did see their personalities become respectively more machine or human, which I thought was nice. John was the one who was helping Cortana, not the other way around, which I also thought was nice for an ironic change. On a side note, repetitiveness is what you get when you have to stick with a series. Enough change to be new, but not so much that it isn't anything like the others. Yes, it is owned by Microsoft. Yes, gameplay is quite the same. But we're talking about story here, and I found nothing repetitive about the story. 343 gave it a nice, concise (some would even say short) story.
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  • Chronarch

    Chronarch

    12/9/2012 2:50:47 PM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] ryan299 theme of halo 4's campaign is to take every fun mission bungie ever designed and put into the campaign. thats the campaign halo 4 is.[/quote] Yeah, no. That was Reach's campaign agenda. [quote]as for story, 343 overdid mc and cortanas story. they essentially made the game a bromance, which doesn't work in video games.[/quote] Er... I think you need to check the definition of "bromance". You evidently completely misinterpreted the relationship between John and Cortana, and how exactly does romance not work in video games anyway? Mass Effect? Shadow of the Colossus? No, I guess the romance in these games just don't work for the sole fact that they're part of a video game medium... That's logic, right there. [quote]its okay to have the bromance as the b-story but it was the a-story in this game. By over doing the bromance they under developed the didact, the forerunners, and the new war.[/quote] See above point, it's clear you've completely misunderstood the themes of the story. The story of the Forerunners and the Didact has been in constant motion and development since the IRIS Saga in 2007 leading up to Halo 3, then in Halo 3 through the Terminals, then through Evolutions, Legends, the Forerunner Saga and The Thursday War. Not to mention Halo 4's Terminals too, which do a tremendous job and compiling together exposition from these other sources and providing exposition on things. The Didact's motivation as a character and personality, for instance, are illustrated in both the main game and the terminals. Let's take a look at some dialogue, shall we? - "The [humans] must be sent home and taught to stand with the galaxy, rather than rail against us and take what they desire. the Mantle shelters all." - "The humans' actions threatened the galaxy, yet we have treated them as the Mantle requires. Their punishment was just." - "They are closer now to the animals they behaved as." - "The humans were not meant to protect others. The Mantle of Responsibility for all things is ours, and ours alone." - "My finest opponent, the Mantle accepts all who live fiercely, who defend their young, who build and struggle and grow, and even those who dominate - as humans have dominated; cruelly, without wisdom." - "They took the Mantle of Responsibility upon themselves, and in so doing, they brought the sickness to our shores." - Faber: "So you agree that Halos are our only solution." Librarian: "I do." Faber: "And your husband?" Librarian: "My husband has a different opinion on what steps to take against the Flood." - "Didact, if the Composer is our final hope to defeat the Flood, no Promethean would resist." - "Humans, your kind brought the Flood to our shores. Now you will aid in ending its threat." - "Your pets have a nobler purpose ahead of them." There is plenty of exposition on the Didact's motives and 'hatred' of humanity in the Terminals, his transformation from providing humanity with the chance to live but in a degraded form, treating them "as the Mantle requires", to growing desperate in his need to defeat the Flood. Now let's move to the Librarian's dialogue in the campaign when she speaks to John and see how this connects. - "Weakened from our conflict, we were no match for the Parasite which pursued you." - "The Forerunners made plans for a final great Journey, but the Didact refused to yield our Mantle of responsibility." - "Such moral concerns faded from the Didact's attention." - "The Composer would grant the Didact his solution and his revenge." Again, the transformation of character is clear. You have to be completely brain dead to say that there is no exposition either in the game or in the Terminals on this subject. The Didact may not have the enigmatic, Lovecraftian fear factor of the Gravemind or the deluded madness of truth, but he's an emotionally driven villain with clear purpose and intent. His dialogue in the Epilogue connects this all together and sets the stage for the next game. [quote]anybody with knowledge of story and structure will tell you that halo 4 is one of the worst stories written. [/quote] As someone who has ardently studied literature ever since I've been able to read, I can tell you that what you're saying is utterly overblown, melodramatic nonsense. The development and ultimate conclusion John and Cortana underwent in Halo 4 was nothing short of poetic, it was beautifully handled by the writing team and brought out by far the most emotion in a Halo game. The Prologue starts off with the questioning of whether John was successful because he was, at his core, broken. It's continued throughout the game, Cortana asking John to find out which one of them is really the machine, and culminates in Lasky's dialogue at the end where he states that soldiers and humanity (machine and man) are no different. John removing his armour in the Epilogue symbolises the exposure of his humanity for what's really the first time in the series - and it took a machine who really was more human than him to make him realise who he is. The conclusion has finally been drawn that he wasn't successful because he was broken at his core, but the "tools" which Halsey supplied (calling Cortana a tool itself being ironic) helped bring out the humanity in John and turned it into his greatest strength. Emotionally, the only games that have ever struck me so effectively through character development are Shadow of the Colossus, Journey and Mass Effect. The progression of the story itself and seeing how it interweaved with over 5 years worth of fiction left me with nothing short of immense respect for 343i's writing team as the dots gradually connected together. It's a sense of intimate involvement the Halo series hasn't captured for me in any of the games beyond Halo 2 and ODST.
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  • Xalener

    Xalener

    12/9/2012 6:12:32 AM Permalink
    I like to think the biggest theme in Halo 4 is basically a meta narrative about the passing of the baton. Chief finds himself lost for years and greeted by an era with a plan he doesn't quite fit into, while his only tether to his own existence (Cortana) fades away. This is pretty analogous to Halo going from Bungie to 343. Some fans abandon the IP, others stay, other non-fans become fans. I think it's pretty clever. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] fez479 Reach had style.[/quote] lolwut Reach was probably the most caster oil Halo we've ever gotten. It was an attempt to swipe away all the camp and theatricality from the previous iterations so we're left with a nice gritty and grounded execution. The problem is that once you take the camp and tongue-and-cheek borderline parody of space opra out of Halo, you're not left with much, because that's pretty much all Halo is. Halo 4 didn't just bring that back, but it -blam!- embraced it. From the Nosferatu design of the Didact to the new John Williamsy musical score (with some good old Davidge Massive Attack sexyness to boot), Halo 4 knew exactly what it came from. I'm not going to argue plot points or any subjective -blam!- like that, because it's a completely inane argument full of points born from the -blam!- of the speaker and whatnot. One thing I will touch on: [quote]Cortana merging with everything blue and holding down Didact, who was beating the crap out of Chief? Can someone say CLICHE?!? [/quote] First of all, all she did was take her messed up copies and project them from a light bridge. You know, the whole hardlight tech that's been a part of the fiction since 2001? She didn't merge with -blam!-. Secondly and more importantly, how is this even a cliche? Please tell me the last time this has happened in a game or a movie. I mean, the closest thing I can think of is 1982's Tron where Flynn jumps into the MCP and distracts him so Tron can deliver the finishing blow, but that's really it. In fact, realizing how analogous Halo 4's ending is to Tron1's ending makes me like it even more. In the chance you mean that simply the act of being in peril and being saved by the person you've been trying to protect is a cliche, then yeah. But the thing is, this is Halo we're talking about. HALO. Are you going to complain about cliches in this intellectual property? Do you really want to go there? I mean, for god's sake, every thread of every story told in the Halo universe revolves around a MYSTERIOUS LOST RACE OF ANCIENT ALIENS. Are you telling me that's not a -blam!- cliche? You play as a genetically modified space marine who just happens to be the only survivor of every plane crash he finds himself in. Are you telling me that's not a -blam!- cliche? Halo is built on cliches and tropes. That's where the god damn charm comes from. Even the gameplay of the first game was a big cliche. It was the ultimate conclusion of every shooter of that generation. It took a bunch of other game's novel new features and shoved them under one roof. Vehicles, COOP, grenade hot buttons, and regenerating shields had existed before, but not all together in the same game. Halo is soup. The gameplay is and always was FPS soup. The stories are and always were Sci Fi soup. Every release of a Halo game is a hodgepodge of the major milestone features that have been made in shooterdom at the time of release. I'm sorry that customizable loadouts got popular this generation, but they did. I'm sorry that writers around the world suddenly have a huge hard-on for the "death and sacrifice" and "personal apocalypse" plot, but they have. Halo goes where the industry goes, dude. That's how it is. That's how it always was. I could have told you years ago that Halo was eventually gonna have a COD style loadout system. If it didn't, it wouldn't be doing it's job. I can predict the next Halo may have some kind of weapon attachment system and some deeper meta-game in the campaign. Perhaps some sort of RPG elements. Maybe an emphasis on stealth since that's been getting big recently. Also of course Halo 4 is a cash-in. It's a cash-in by one of the biggest corporations in the world throwing the most money they've ever thrown at the biggest project they've ever had under the biggest IP they've ever owned with the most elite group of artists and engineers they could buy... and it shows. It doesn't matter what you feel about it personally. They but a billion bucks into the game, and if you bought it, you're playing a billion bucks worth of game. Like it or not. [Edited on 12.08.2012 10:56 PM PST]
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  • Connor Kenway 99

    Connor Kenway 99

    12/9/2012 1:41:51 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] ryan299 theme of halo 4's campaign is to take every fun mission bungie ever designed and put into the campaign. thats the campaign halo 4 is. as for story, 343 overdid mc and cortanas story. they essentially made the game a bromance, which doesn't work in video games. its okay to have the bromance as the b-story but it was the a-story in this game. By over doing the bromance they under developed the didact, the forerunners, and the new war. anybody with knowledge of story and structure will tell you that halo 4 is one of the worst stories written. [/quote] Ive read most of halo's lore and still though halo 4 had a great story. Seriously what bromance? Master chief showing emotion for cortana who was dying? Thats the only emotional side of chief I saw.
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  • Connor Kenway 99

    Connor Kenway 99

    12/9/2012 1:40:03 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] fez479 Halo 4's theme: "How much Call of Duty can we shoehorn into this game?" EDIT: Sorry I see you meant single player: "How much Halo lore can we put in here to distract longtime fans from the absurd amounts of Call of Duty in the multiplayer?"[/quote] Dude -blam!- the multiplayer. The campaign alone is worth buying this game. What a great story. I only wish it had more to do with the precursors who're supposed to be the biggest threat to the galaxy right now.
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  • ryan299

    ryan299

    12/9/2012 1:28:31 AM Permalink
    theme of halo 4's campaign is to take every fun mission bungie ever designed and put into the campaign. thats the campaign halo 4 is. as for story, 343 overdid mc and cortanas story. they essentially made the game a bromance, which doesn't work in video games. its okay to have the bromance as the b-story but it was the a-story in this game. By over doing the bromance they under developed the didact, the forerunners, and the new war. anybody with knowledge of story and structure will tell you that halo 4 is one of the worst stories written.
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  • Kyle Knight

    Kyle Knight

    12/8/2012 5:35:03 AM Permalink
    "Wake up John" acts as a highlight to the overall theme of the game's plot. While John is still the able-bodied master of weapons and vehicles, the universe arround him has changed from the victories of humanity during the Human Covenant War. Chief's allies are gone, spread out, or dead, and the UNSC he returns to is a stronger, sturdier, yet less experienced group that disregards Chief's importance, despite the fact that the officer has saved humanity on multiple occasions. He is old news, and the world no longer needs him to hide from the Covenant threat. Humanity controls a powerful fleet with the knowledge of enemy weaponry and devices that human forces before them would have been lucky to get a hold of and use properly. The game has changed, and with Chief out of the loop, the universe has moved on. Therefore, "time marches on" acts as one of the strongest themes, where the chief-a victim of ignorance as a result of a long slumber-must force himself back into the reality of war. The battle he knows and was nearly bred to fight in is over. His best friend, Cortana, is dead. Time marches on, and whether he likes it or not, he must "carry on" too, or die with the memories of a war won years ago.
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  • NAStheMagiking

    NAStheMagiking

    12/8/2012 5:04:34 AM Permalink
    Reach had a bland story, bland characters, bland art and bland gameplay. To say that it was better than 4 is an utter joke. Reach was Bungie's attempt at giving us a more human story. Characters we cared for, and were more than just silent cliched protagonists. They did not succeed...at all, I'm afraid. I felt nothing for Noble Team, and in contrast 4 evoked genuine emotion. It's the first time in all the Halo games, if I'm honest. [Edited on 12.07.2012 9:11 PM PST]
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  • fez479

    fez479

    12/8/2012 5:00:23 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] fsabran [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] fez479 [/quote] 1- then why post in a Halo thread. 2- or you know people who still enjoy it. 3-Halo started as a single player game and is a single player game, if multiplayer is that important then why make all the novels, or the comics, or the entire Extended Universe, because its a single player game at its heart, do you vist any other lore focused forum aside from here, because if you did you would know that because of the multiplayer community we have all the inconsitensies and plotholes, and the general stupidity that is know to come from halo lore because you want " herp a derp balanced guns" that are equal to 1960's guns and -blam!-. 4-what? do you mean the game when bungie said " herp, lets take the fall of reach and all previous estabilished canon and throw it in the trash so we can make a generic and uninspired Sci-fi story Herp a derp" , please, 4 beats it in every way story telling wise (AKA the only thing that actually matters) especialy because it doesnt throw all the EU in the trash.[/quote] I wrote in a Halo thread because #1 the thread was just asking for a joke, and #2 Halo 4 sucks and is a betrayal to the Halo series and I wanted to express that opinion. I really don't think you understood what I said about the Halo fanbase. Please read your old comment and then mine because what you said not only makes no sense, but is retarded. Halo [i]started[/i] as a single player game sure, but it very quickly (Halo 2) became a multiplayer game with a story that could decently hold it's own. Sure, Halo is big enough to warrant tens of books etc, but the real fun comes in the competitive multiplayer. Every Halo fan knows that (besides a small handful of people who are in denial apparently). Halo 4's single player was crap compared to Reach's because the gameplay sucked, and the story was so bland it was sad. Reach had style. Reach had tragedy. Sure they had to mess with the canon a bit and that's unfortunate, but it made for a great game. Halo 4 was just another run-of-the-mill game that ruined what Halo had going for it. Also to the guy who claimed that Reach had no character development: First of all the obsession with character development is something that only people with absolutely no understanding of story telling/writing continue to perpetuate. Just look at a great movie like The Big Lebowski, or the classic book The Stranger. Character development is the kitsch of writing, and if you NEED a reason to sympathize with someone then you are probably a sociopath and should go get psychiatric treatment. Second of all, if you think that Reach didn't have character development then you clearly didn't play the game AT ALL. Character development was one of the main things they strove to do, and they very much succeeded.
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  • fsabran

    fsabran

    12/7/2012 3:17:28 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] fez479 [/quote] 1- then why post in a Halo thread. 2- or you know people who still enjoy it. 3-Halo started as a single player game and is a single player game, if multiplayer is that important then why make all the novels, or the comics, or the entire Extended Universe, because its a single player game at its heart, do you vist any other lore focused forum aside from here, because if you did you would know that because of the multiplayer community we have all the inconsitensies and plotholes, and the general stupidity that is know to come from halo lore because you want " herp a derp balanced guns" that are equal to 1960's guns and -blam!-. 4-what? do you mean the game when bungie said " herp, lets take the fall of reach and all previous estabilished canon and throw it in the trash so we can make a generic and uninspired Sci-fi story Herp a derp" , please, 4 beats it in every way story telling wise (AKA the only thing that actually matters) especialy because it doesnt throw all the EU in the trash. [Edited on 12.06.2012 7:22 PM PST]
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  • ROBERTO jh

    ROBERTO jh

    12/7/2012 1:15:49 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] fez479 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] fsabran [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] fez479 Halo 4's theme: "How much Call of Duty can we shoehorn into this game?" EDIT: Sorry I see you meant single player: "How much Halo lore can we put in here to distract longtime fans from the absurd amounts of Call of Duty in the multiplayer?"[/quote]Why are you even posting in the universe then, -blam!- the multiplayer, it could be a carbon copy of cod and i would like it as long as the story was good, and you people call yourselves fans, theres a reason why the halo fanbase is considered a joke in place's like spacebattles or bigger gaming sites, and the reason is the retarded multiplayer community.[/quote] #4 Halo 4's campaign couldn't even touch Reach's. SPOILERS c'mon... Cortana merging with everything blue and holding down Didact, who was beating the crap out of Chief? Can someone say CLICHE?!? /SPOILERS[/quote] Cortana pulled that off because she was using hard light technology. Do you even know what the word cliche means? You know what else is cliche? Bruce Willis staying behind to blow up the big bad space invader, but now with aliens and a Spartan. I suppose having no character development isn't cliche, so much as it is -blam!- writing, though. What Halo 4 did have--character development, a story you had to actually pay attention too, respect for the lore, legitimately emotional sequences, and good writing--puts it above Reach the same way the moon is above my house.
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  • fez479

    fez479

    12/7/2012 12:34:35 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] fsabran [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] fez479 Halo 4's theme: "How much Call of Duty can we shoehorn into this game?" EDIT: Sorry I see you meant single player: "How much Halo lore can we put in here to distract longtime fans from the absurd amounts of Call of Duty in the multiplayer?"[/quote]Why are you even posting in the universe then, -blam!- the multiplayer, it could be a carbon copy of cod and i would like it as long as the story was good, and you people call yourselves fans, theres a reason why the halo fanbase is considered a joke in place's like spacebattles or bigger gaming sites, and the reason is the retarded multiplayer community.[/quote] #1 I'm posting here because I like Destiny and the new info. #2 Bungie has a great fanbase. Unfortunately Halo is constantly hounded by posers who just play the next fad. #3 Halo is primarily a multiplayer game. The single player is fun and the story can be quite interesting (ODST was great), but when it comes down to it I couldn't call a Halo game even close to good if 70% was crap. Multiplayer is also mostly about the gameplay, which greatly affects the Campaign. You also just lost all credibility by claiming that the multiplayer fanbase ruins Halo because there are hordes of very respected Halo MLG players. #4 Halo 4's campaign couldn't even touch Reach's. SPOILERS c'mon... Cortana merging with everything blue and holding down Didact, who was beating the crap out of Chief? Can someone say CLICHE?!? /SPOILERS
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  • xAT 117x

    xAT 117x

    12/6/2012 10:36:13 PM Permalink
    I personally think the the theme was Man (humanity) vs Machine. As Cortana becomes increasingly rampant she becomes increasingly human, and in contrast the Chief has to become more machine like and hide his emotions (more than he usually does) to make sure they both don't fall apart. At the end you're not meant to be sure whether Cortana's "death" has brought Chief back to his humanity or pushed him completely over the edge into machine territory. That is what I got from it anyway...
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  • fsabran

    fsabran

    12/4/2012 9:48:38 PM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] fez479 Halo 4's theme: "How much Call of Duty can we shoehorn into this game?" EDIT: Sorry I see you meant single player: "How much Halo lore can we put in here to distract longtime fans from the absurd amounts of Call of Duty in the multiplayer?"[/quote]Why are you even posting in the universe then, -blam!- the multiplayer, it could be a carbon copy of cod and i would like it as long as the story was good, and you people call yourselves fans, theres a reason why the halo fanbase is considered a joke in place's like spacebattles or bigger gaming sites, and the reason is the retarded multiplayer community. [Edited on 12.04.2012 1:54 PM PST]
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  • Wolvers

    Wolvers

    12/4/2012 9:40:16 PM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Haloroach [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] BobBQ [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Aang the Avatar Wow, just like your arguments for why Halo 4 is bad I'm sure.[/quote] Oh, I don't think Halo 4 is a [i]bad[/i] game. I just think it's a tedious, uninspired game cranked out by a corporation intent on squeezing another billion dollars from a decade-long cash cow's target demographic.[/quote] And I don't. Thanks for derailing the thread.[/quote] You should report him. OT: Human nature. [Edited on 12.04.2012 1:42 PM PST]
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  • ROBERTO jh

    ROBERTO jh

    12/4/2012 9:40:03 PM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Haloroach So many, but the main theme of Halo 4 is an evolution of the main theme of "Halo" itself. What "humanity" truly is, what humanity's place is, and what the purpose of life is.[/quote] This, basically. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] CruddiestBlock1 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SCORCHHEAD The Theme- Frank O'connor- "Hey Bill! I had a great idea!" Bill gates-"Oh yeah?" Frank- "Definetely! We totally half-ass the entire goddamn thing, make even the campaign, like, not even 6 hours on normal, save money, and make double the profits!!!" *Bill Gates laughs evily"[/quote] That's how I felt at the end of the campaign. It was like they tried to use halo 4 as a means to advertise their books. Personally I felt that they tried to squeeze a bunch of lore and useless info into the story. I think they saw this as an opportunity to sell books and such rather than expand on the game as a whole. I was pissed about the campaign. I thought frank said it would be longer than the traditional campaign. Did he not?[/quote] He said it'd be AS long, which it was. [Edited on 12.04.2012 1:41 PM PST]
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  • Skorchhead

    Skorchhead

    12/4/2012 9:30:53 PM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] CruddiestBlock1 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SCORCHHEAD The Theme- Frank O'connor- "Hey Bill! I had a great idea!" Bill gates-"Oh yeah?" Frank- "Definetely! We totally half-ass the entire goddamn thing, make even the campaign, like, not even 6 hours on normal, save money, and make double the profits!!!" *Bill Gates laughs evily"[/quote] That's how I felt at the end of the campaign. It was like they tried to use halo 4 as a means to advertise their books. Personally I felt that they tried to squeeze a bunch of lore and useless info into the story. I think they saw this as an opportunity to sell books and such rather than expand on the game as a whole. I was pissed about the campaign. I thought frank said it would be longer than the traditional campaign. Did he not?[/quote] Cant you just picture Bill gates stroking a cat, in a big chair and laughing evily about all the money we gave them?
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  • BlackKnightKanos

    BlackKnightKanos

    12/4/2012 10:27:21 AM Permalink
    Since this is turning into an "I hate Halo 4" thread. I'll answer this one seriously. I would say that Halo 4 is about triumphing even in defeat. Master Chief's whole journey in Halo 4 has been nothing but countless defeats. He loses Cortana, his contributions are not acknowledged by Infinity, he failed to save the people in the Ivanoff Research Station. Lastly, all the civilians of New Phoenix were composed and he had to destroy the Composer. In turn, killing all the civilians that became digital AIs. It's about what you're willing to do for a cause. How far are you willing to go for a cause. [Edited on 12.04.2012 2:27 AM PST]
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  • GhostLink2401

    GhostLink2401

    12/4/2012 8:15:22 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Drunky1993 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] GhostLink2401 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] BobBQ [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Aang the Avatar Wow, just like your arguments for why Halo 4 is bad I'm sure.[/quote] Oh, I don't think Halo 4 is a [i]bad[/i] game. I just think it's a tedious, uninspired game cranked out by a corporation intent on squeezing another billion dollars from a decade-long cash cow's target demographic.[/quote] I know you guys don't get paid for Ninja'ing, but I find it ironic that you work (for lack of a better term) for the very company that created said series. Just out of curiosity, would you be this outspoken about it if Bungie HAD made it? Not trying to sound like a jackass, I'm genuinely curious. Not trying to provoke a Ninja here.[/quote] Or what if he thinks that Halo 4 truly is a bad game? Just because you slap "Halo" on the title doesn't make it an instant blessing. In fact he's very rationale for pointing out his opinion on the matter. It shows he takes a game for what it is and not for what it was, or what it is supposed to be. [/quote] It has it's flaws, yeah. It's far from perfect, but I don't recall seeing Ninjas openly not like Halo before Bungie released control. Maybe I just never noticed it.
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  • Drunky1993

    Drunky1993

    12/4/2012 6:57:39 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] GhostLink2401 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] BobBQ [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Aang the Avatar Wow, just like your arguments for why Halo 4 is bad I'm sure.[/quote] Oh, I don't think Halo 4 is a [i]bad[/i] game. I just think it's a tedious, uninspired game cranked out by a corporation intent on squeezing another billion dollars from a decade-long cash cow's target demographic.[/quote] I know you guys don't get paid for Ninja'ing, but I find it ironic that you work (for lack of a better term) for the very company that created said series. Just out of curiosity, would you be this outspoken about it if Bungie HAD made it? Not trying to sound like a jackass, I'm genuinely curious. Not trying to provoke a Ninja here.[/quote] Or what if he thinks that Halo 4 truly is a bad game? Just because you slap "Halo" on the title doesn't make it an instant blessing. In fact he's very rationale for pointing out his opinion on the matter. It shows he takes a game for what it is and not for what it was, or what it is supposed to be.
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  • NAStheMagiking

    NAStheMagiking

    12/4/2012 4:48:12 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] CruddiestBlock1 [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SCORCHHEAD The Theme- Frank O'connor- "Hey Bill! I had a great idea!" Bill gates-"Oh yeah?" Frank- "Definetely! We totally half-ass the entire goddamn thing, make even the campaign, like, not even 6 hours on normal, save money, and make double the profits!!!" *Bill Gates laughs evily"[/quote] That's how I felt at the end of the campaign. It was like they tried to use halo 4 as a means to advertise their books. Personally I felt that they tried to squeeze a bunch of lore and useless info into the story. I think they saw this as an opportunity to sell books and such rather than expand on the game as a whole. I was pissed about the campaign. I thought frank said it would be longer than the traditional campaign. Did he not?[/quote]I think the Campaign succeeded in giving us more of a story than prior games ever had. A story that was told a lot better, too. 'Chief and Cortana's journey is probably the best thing to happen to the series, Campaign-wise. So well done. Frank said it'd be as long as other games have been. I'd say that's correct.
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  • CruddiestBlock1

    CruddiestBlock1

    12/4/2012 4:38:42 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] SCORCHHEAD The Theme- Frank O'connor- "Hey Bill! I had a great idea!" Bill gates-"Oh yeah?" Frank- "Definetely! We totally half-ass the entire goddamn thing, make even the campaign, like, not even 6 hours on normal, save money, and make double the profits!!!" *Bill Gates laughs evily"[/quote] That's how I felt at the end of the campaign. It was like they tried to use halo 4 as a means to advertise their books. Personally I felt that they tried to squeeze a bunch of lore and useless info into the story. I think they saw this as an opportunity to sell books and such rather than expand on the game as a whole. I was pissed about the campaign. I thought frank said it would be longer than the traditional campaign. Did he not?
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