JavaScript is required to use Bungie.net

#Halo
0
Spawned

Spawned

5/12/2010 5:02:41 AM
First, I half-way did this to upset people. However, the more I think about it, the more it makes sense. So we know Bungie said Halo and Marathon are different universes. We also know about a certain ex-executive slipping and trying to recall his statement that MC and the security officer are the same people. These are givens, they are not refutable. Well here is how they are going to tie it in. It all has to do with 7, but you won't understand that unless you figure out the secret to 7 (think religion). So, here are a few things to tie it together. Slip space travel is actually travel between universes, and it is possible to exit into alternate opposed universes. That's my theory, but if you played all their games, you can see why I theorized on this, especially the third Marathon. We know the Halo distress takes place in the 2500's, irrefutable. We know outside of that the universe was relatively calm since the Forerunners, just skirmishes at the best between human colonies. We know in Marathon, the universes is in distress more often than not. We also know nothing of note happened in the 2500's. Bare with me, all this will tie in soon. We known Guilty Spark 343 recognized the Chief for some reason. Why, we don't know. We know at the end of Halo 3 the Chief's half of the ship split off from the other during a closure in slip space. So what does this all mean. For this to work we need to give a little way to science fiction. Let's assume that rogue AI, such as Cortana (Halo) and Beowulf (Marathon) are not confined to the physical limitations of dimensions like organic life and that information is open freely between them. Let's conclude that the Forerunner's were advanced enough to cross through time and dimensions. It's plausible considering them. In doing so they created an information link that transcends time and space for computers. Consider this could be very confusing to the AI involved. For this, I say Beowulf = Guilty Spark 343, in a manner of speaking. This is why he recognizes the chief. So when one universe is in distress, the other is calm. For every action there must be an equal and opposite reaction. When the Chief, Arbiter and Cortana tried to make the slip space jump, the ship split. Sending the Arbiter back to his universe and MC and Cortana to the Marathon universe. The Chief is put into stasis with the instructions to Cortana to wake him when he is needed. Cortana has a life span that is almost over. During their free float, Cortana overflows with information and implodes. The Chief is not monitored or awaken and passes in his perfect frozen state. One day he is found, genetically superior, with incredible technology. Someone, some scientist, decides he is a perfect test subject for a super soldier program. Graphs on cyborg technology onto his body to reanimate him. He is employed at what he does best war. Becoming employed to the security officer position for his extreme prowess on the battle field. Now we have a seamless transition that works with the Marathon time line and Halo time line. Bungie, I have a job, that I hate, so if you want to pay me to write story lines, let me know. I appreciate the ingenuity that you used to make sure when you left the death grip of MS that you could keep your hero for further games without violating IP ownership rights. Awesome job! And on the 7th day he rested.

Edit Preview Cancel

  • 0
    macfanz1

    macfanz1

    5/14/2010 7:12:47 AM Permalink
    The closure of the Universe shall set them [i]free.[/i] Might as well begin to put up the chairs and lock the door, 'cuz this discussion goes to infinity, which is way farther than the end of the world.
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    S034

    S034

    5/13/2010 7:30:15 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] cortana 5 And the Precursor and Forerunner info is from the Bestiarum that comes with certain Halo 3 editions.[/quote] Didn't they also throw that stuff into the Halo Encyclopedia? I don't know for sure because I never bought it (I hear tell that it was basically obsolete upon release anyway), but I think I've heard it mentioned that it's in there, as well. Just one more "official" source to tack on which is in no way based on "fan-based lore and speculation."
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    Cortana Five

    Cortana Five

    5/13/2010 6:18:55 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spawned Maybe slip space travel is travel between dimensions and Marathon and Halo are different dimensions of the same universe. Again no one can come in here as cavalier as you just did and claim any theory is impossible. Unless you own Bungie at which point you can.[/quote]Good sir, know your cannon. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Sardonic13 [u][b]Also, AIs in Halo and Marathon [i]are[/i] confined to the physical limitations of dimensions.[/b][/u] AIs require a computer system in which to exist. In Marathon, a planet sized network is required to fully support a rampant AI. While Cortana and Durandal can transfer from one system to another, they must always have a system in which to store their data. [/quote] Here's some more cannon: Understand that the term "slipspace" in the Halo universe has only been used for travel from one part of the galaxy/universe to another part. It has never brought anyone to another universe. Even the Forerunner never managed to do such a thing. The Precursors (a civilization before the Forerunner) used it to go from galaxy to galaxy and on top of that were able to accelerate evolutionary life. Sources: [url=http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Slipstream_Space#Sources]Take your pick.[/url] And the Precursor and Forerunner info is from the Bestiarum that comes with certain Halo 3 editions.
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    Sardonic13

    Sardonic13

    5/13/2010 3:38:15 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] petarded2 When your theory relies more on what hasn't been explained than what has, you no longer have a theory, you have wild speculation.[/quote]Exactly my point.
  • 0
    S034

    S034

    5/13/2010 3:30:26 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spawned For the last time, the only thing Bungie said is they are not the SAME universe.[/quote] You're mistaking the idea of a canonical universe for a physical one. [quote]1. If they can prove MC is an IP before Halo, and Microsoft owns the rights to Halo, than legally they can make a claim at the MC as not being owned by Microsoft. There is a lot of law that you and even I, a man related to way too many lawyers, could even begin to untangle. So don't take everything at face value.[/quote] No court is going to uphold Master Chief being retconned into the Marathon universe as being proof of his prior existence. Maybe if there were well-documented Bungie records created at the time of [b][u][i]MARATHON'S[/i][/u][/b] creation that showed that the two were obviously the same (like, for instance, if the Security Officer's serial number was SPARTAN-117), they could pull it off. But unless there's irrefutable proof, it's gonna go to Microsoft. And I don't think Bungie's going to risk a lawsuit from one of the most powerful companies on the planet just for one guy in a green suit. [quote]2. Marathon does end with the end of the universe, but if MC is the SG, than he was in at least 3 games before he was finished off, and therefore they can by theory be the same person.[/quote] But the point is that Bungie CANNOT GO ANYWHERE ELSE WITH THIS STORY. IT HAS BEEN TOLD. WE KNOW HOW IT ENDS. There's no point in telling it again just to slip the Chief in. [quote]3. I am not discrediting anyone's post of idea. I simply stated someone is over-reaching, which is not the same as grasping. This merely means cortana5 could be correct, but is probably assuming a lot more historical connections than Bungie probably considered.[/quote] So you somehow think it's coincidence that two of two AIs bear the names of related mythological swords? HAVE YOU EVEN SEEN HOW FREAKING IN-DEPTH THESE GUYS GET? To ignore this connection is to ignore everything that is Bungie. Very little is ever accidental when Bungie is involved, and this is too big to be a coincidence. [quote]4. The truh, the real truth, is this mess with MS and the years that have gone by could and probably did change the actual vision. I am without a doubt in my mind positive that the MC was originally designed as the SG and Halo as a prequel and I believe they had all these possible connection points to use to merge them. However, I think unforeseeable things and changes in leadership and staff as morphed the original intent. The point simply is, that these ideas that Halo = Marathon = MC = SG is not far fetched and was probably the prevailing concept back at Bungie. We will probably never know unless we work for Bungie one day. Even then they probably wouldn't elaborate.[/quote] So what you're saying is that your argument is completely irrelevant. If we will never know, then your assertion that Bungie will introduce [i][u]MARTAHON[/u][/i] as their next title cannot POSSIBLY be true. [quote]The only thing I do know is the number 7 in religion is the number of completeness, perfection if you will, though some think 10 is this number, others say 777 is the number of perfection and so on. So as far as it all, at least I know why Bungie is obsessed with the number of 7.[/quote]First: Bungie's love affair with the number seven isn't a news flash for anyone, but said love affair does not govern every little move the company makes. That would be dumb. Second: Unless you explain how Bungie's love of seven has any sort of bearing on your argument other than being a convenient justification for a "seventh game" to act as a bridge between Halo and Marathon (which is a damn long stretch in and of itself, because it would mean writing off not only Halo Wars and ODST but also Reach), this is irrelevant to the point of insanity. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spawned Sardonic 13. A theory is nothing more than some facts wrapped in with assumptions. So everyone's theory is a baseless assumption.[/quote] If there are facts, it's impossible to be "baseless". That's essential to the definition of "baseless". [quote]Maybe slip space travel is travel between dimensions and Marathon and Halo are different dimensions of the same universe.[/quote] Slipspace isn't another dimension; it's a warping of this one. This has been addressed. Not to mention that a being which exists in four dimensions (Length, width, height and time) such as the Master Chief would not translate well into a fifth or sixth dimension. I think he'd die, at best. Not only that, the amount of writing needed to explain something this complex would be ludicrous, and would make for a not-so-entertaining game. [quote]Again no one can come in here as cavalier as you just did and claim any theory is impossible. Unless you own Bungie at which point you can.[/quote] Of course he can't claim it's impossible, because Bungie can defy all logic and reasoning and drop in something as ridiculously [i]deus ex machina[/i] as this if they really want to. But you didn't present anything to refute his assertion that [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Sardonic13 The SO was born on Mars and remembers his father. He spent 300 years aboard the Marathon traveling from Sol to Tau Ceti. He acted as a security officer on the colony for at least 3 years before the Pfhor attack on the Marathon. The MC cannot be simply dropped into the Marathon Universe after surviving the events of Halo 3 and become the SO.[/quote] Inter-dimensional travel or not, this makes your theory highly illogical. Bungie would have to blow a horrendous hole in their own canon in order to pull it off, and it would just seem like terrible writing. Your theory and this data are irreconcilable. In fact, nearly everything Sardonic 13 said runs in opposition to your theory, and you didn't address any of it adequately. Of course the Covenant saw major military activity outside of the window of the 2500s. Or did you forget that there was a major war between the Elites and the Prophets before the Covenant was formed? Or that the Flood and the Sentinels have been at war on Delta Halo for a hundred thousand years? And he's completely right in saying that you can't assume that the Forerunners were capable of inter-dimensional or inter-universal travel because there is no evidence to suggest that they could. Even if you could somehow make that assumption, you still didn't address why the Forerunners didn't simply deal with the Flood by banishing it to another dimension, or escaping to another universe themselves. You can't simply dismiss counterarguments to your theory with offhand dismissals and simple avoidance of acknowledgment. As an addendum; nowhere in this entire thread have you given a single logical reason why Bungie would risk a lawsuit from Microsoft simply to bring the Master Chief into a game series which they concluded over ten years ago. There isn't a good reason to do it. To assume that Bungie somehow needs to continue working with the Master Chief in a universe which they have already fully established does a disservice to their well-established creative abilities. Bungie is more than capable of coming up with a fantastic new universe, and to simply put a used character into a used universe makes no sense. I have made this argument multiple times now, but you have not addressed it. Begin presenting adequate counterarguments or [u][i]GET THEE GONE![/i][/u] [Edited on 05.12.2010 10:07 PM PDT]
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    petard

    petard

    5/13/2010 3:01:09 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spawned Also to tell me I can't assume anything is kind of funny. There have been hints that Forerunner's could have possessed time travel capability. We just don't know, not until Bungie releases an FPS based on Master Chief of the Forerunners.[/quote] You can make assumptions, you pretty much have to in order to make a theory. But there is a difference between assuming a few things and jumping to random conclusions constantly without any sources. When your theory relies more on what hasn't been explained than what has, you no longer have a theory, you have wild speculation. [Edited on 05.12.2010 7:02 PM PDT]
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    Spawned

    Spawned

    5/13/2010 2:50:56 AM Permalink
    Also to tell me I can't assume anything is kind of funny. There have been hints that Forerunner's could have possessed time travel capability. We just don't know, not until Bungie releases an FPS based on Master Chief of the Forerunners.
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    Spawned

    Spawned

    5/13/2010 2:48:56 AM Permalink
    Sardonic 13. A theory is nothing more than some facts wrapped in with assumptions. So everyone's theory is a baseless assumption. If it wasn't full of baseless assumptions and all facts, it wouldn't be a theory, it would be a fact, a law if you will. Of course, to call me hypocritical, you are to call yourself hypocritical. I never said my theory wasn't assumption or speculation, as is everyone else' theory, so to attack me for doing the same as others, put the pieces together. There is no fact or lore to support your conclusion that the Covenant caused any major conflicts outside of that specific time fame. This is your assumption, so let's leave that at what it is. Maybe slip space travel is travel between dimensions and Marathon and Halo are different dimensions of the same universe. Again no one can come in here as cavalier as you just did and claim any theory is impossible. Unless you own Bungie at which point you can. Beowulf was suppose to say Durandal. I don't know why Beowulf came to my mind, probably because I was reading the series again and that name stuck in my mind.
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    Sardonic13

    Sardonic13

    5/13/2010 2:23:24 AM Permalink
    I'm not quite sure what you are getting at with the original post. It contains little more than vague implications and assumptions based loosely on other assumptions. Nothing in your post offers even the slightest circumstantial evidence that the next game Bungie will be working on is Marathon or Marathon related (if that is, as the title suggests, the true purpose of this thread). [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spawned It [A connection between Marathon and Halo] all has to do with 7, but you won't understand that unless you figure out the secret to 7 (think religion).[/quote]And what exactly is this grand "secret to 7"? If it is so vital to how Marathon and Halo supposedly tie together, why don't you elaborate on it? [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spawned Slip space travel is actually travel between universes, and it is possible to exit into alternate opposed universes. That's my theory, but if you played all their games, you can see why I theorized on this, especially the third Marathon.[/quote]This is a baseless assumption on your part. There is no indication that Slipspace travel connects different universes. According to the [url=http://halostory.bungie.org/halostory.timeline.html]Halo Timeline[/url], "Slipspace is a domain with alternate physical laws, allowing faster-than-light travel without relativistic side-effects. Faster-than-light travel is not instantaneous; "short" jumps routinely take up to two months, and "long" jumps can last six months or more." It is a method of traveling from one point to another inside the Halo universe. By the time Halo takes place, humanity has been traveling through Slipspace for hundreds of years and there are no documented cases of traveling to a different universe. You're vague Marathon Infinity reference doesn't hold water either. During Infinity, the SO travels to other times and realities, but always within the Marathon universe. The SO does not cross over into a different universe. Also, his Jjaro implants are what allow him to traverse realities. His trips have nothing to do with Halo's Slipspace travel. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spawned We know the Halo distress takes place in the 2500's, irrefutable. We know outside of that the universe was relatively calm since the Forerunners, just skirmishes at the best between human colonies. We know in Marathon, the universes is in distress more often than not. We also know nothing of note happened in the 2500's.[/quote]Outside the Halo universe? The Forerunners don't exist outside the Halo universe. I'll take "outside of that universe" to mean events occurring in the Halo universe before 2500. If that is in fact what you meant, it is also a poor assumption. While the Flood and Forerunners may not have contributed to wars and fighting, the sheer number of former Arbiters in the Mausoleum of the Arbiters is proof that the Covenant saw significant military activity. Likewise, while we know that in the [url=http://marathon.bungie.org/story/timetable.html]Marathon Timeline[/url] nothing of note happened between 2472 and 2611, that doesn't mean that all other centuries were inundated with conflicts. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spawned We known Guilty Spark 343 recognized the Chief for some reason. Why, we don't know.[/quote]As others have indicated, Guilty Spark recognized the MC because there is a connection between humanity and the Forerunners. This is corroborated by the fact that the Tartarus and Truth need Miranda Keyes and Sgt. Johnson respectively to activate the Halos. Truth even calls the Forerunners Sgt. Johnson's forefathers. This is all proof of a connection between humanity and the Forerunners. It has nothing to do with Marathon. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spawned Let's assume that rogue AI, such as Cortana (Halo) and Beowulf (Marathon) are not confined to the physical limitations of dimensions like organic life and that information is open freely between them. Let's conclude that the Forerunner's were advanced enough to cross through time and dimensions. It's plausible considering them. In doing so they created an information link that transcends time and space for computers.[/quote] Cortana is hardly a "rogue" AI. She has freewill and self-awareness, but is also loyal and self-sacrificing. And who is Beowulf? To my knowledge there are no AIs in Marathon by that name. The only character in Marathon even compared to Beowulf is the SO. Also, AIs in Halo and Marathon [i]are[/i] confined to the physical limitations of dimensions. AIs require a computer system in which to exist. In Marathon, a planet sized network is required to fully support a rampant AI. While Cortana and Durandal can transfer from one system to another, they must always have a system in which to store their data. You can't [i]assume[/i] that the Forerunners were advanced enough to cross through time and dimensions. If they were, why didn't they eliminate the Flood by isolating it in another dimension or simply escape to another dimension themselves? There is no evidence that the Forerunners were capable of sending data to other dimensions or universes. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spawned For this, I say Beowulf = Guilty Spark 343, in a manner of speaking. This is why he recognizes the chief.[/quote]Again, who the hell is Beowulf? Are you trying to say that in addition to being himself in Halo, 343 Guilty Spark is also another character in Marathon? [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spawned When the Chief, Arbiter and Cortana tried to make the slip space jump, the ship split. Sending the Arbiter back to his universe and MC and Cortana to the Marathon universe.[/quote]Another baseless assumption. It is true that the Arbiter and MC traveled to different locations, but there is no evidence that MC ended up anywhere other than an unspecified location inside the Halo universe. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spawned One day he [MC] is found, genetically superior, with incredible technology. Someone, some scientist, decides he is a perfect test subject for a super soldier program. Graphs on cyborg technology onto his body to reanimate him. He is employed at what he does best war. Becoming employed to the security officer position for his extreme prowess on the battle field.[/quote]Here you are basically saying that the MC and SO are the same person without really saying it. Like it or not, the SO has a past which is inconsistent with both the MC's past and your theory. The SO was born on Mars and remembers his father. He spent 300 years aboard the Marathon traveling from Sol to Tau Ceti. He acted as a security officer on the colony for at least 3 years before the Pfhor attack on the Marathon. The MC cannot be simply dropped into the Marathon Universe after surviving the events of Halo 3 and become the SO. [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spawned Now we have a seamless transition that works with the Marathon time line and Halo time line.[/quote]This couldn't be farther from the truth. To be quite honest, I don't see your post as any sort of coherent theory. It is a collection of tenuously connected assumptions, none of which have any strong foundations in Halo or Marathon canon. I love Bungie story theories as much as anyone. However I find that posting a hodgepodge of your own personal assumptions with little canon-based evidence then dismissing the arguments of others as "pure speculation" or being based on "fan lore and speculation" is nothing short of hypocritical.
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    Spawned

    Spawned

    5/13/2010 2:09:14 AM Permalink
    For the last time, the only thing Bungie said is they are not the SAME universe. I am OK if my theory is entirely incorrect. I won't lose sleep over it. You take this too seriously, however a few things you need to understand. 1. If they can prove MC is an IP before Halo, and Microsoft owns the rights to Halo, than legally they can make a claim at the MC as not being owned by Microsoft. There is a lot of law that you and even I, a man related to way too many lawyers, could even begin to untangle. So don't take everything at face value. 2. Marathon does end with the end of the universe, but if MC is the SG, than he was in at least 3 games before he was finished off, and therefore they can by theory be the same person. 3. I am not discrediting anyone's post of idea. I simply stated someone is over-reaching, which is not the same as grasping. This merely means cortana5 could be correct, but is probably assuming a lot more historical connections than Bungie probably considered. 4. The truh, the real truth, is this mess with MS and the years that have gone by could and probably did change the actual vision. I am without a doubt in my mind positive that the MC was originally designed as the SG and Halo as a prequel and I believe they had all these possible connection points to use to merge them. However, I think unforeseeable things and changes in leadership and staff as morphed the original intent. The point simply is, that these ideas that Halo = Marathon = MC = SG is not far fetched and was probably the prevailing concept back at Bungie. We will probably never know unless we work for Bungie one day. Even then they probably wouldn't elaborate. The only thing I do know is the number 7 in religion is the number of completeness, perfection if you will, though some think 10 is this number, others say 777 is the number of perfection and so on. So as far as it all, at least I know why Bungie is obsessed with the number of 7.
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    Destroyer1217

    Destroyer1217

    5/13/2010 1:48:52 AM Permalink
    In my opinion, I see Halo and Marathon as different games made in similar ways. I think that Bungie took many ideas from Marathon into creating Halo, since they were losing their jobs not thinking that fan bases would theorize the new franchise if the game were to be successful. I just don't see how, if they are different games with different stories, they can mix. But this is just my opinion afterall... [Edited on 05.12.2010 5:52 PM PDT]
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    S034

    S034

    5/12/2010 11:56:19 PM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] cortana 5[/quote]Agreed, and [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Ibeechu[/quote]Agreed. Even if they somehow did manage to shift the Chief to a new universe, which I find FAR more ludicrous to believe than cortana 5's theory regarding the sword-AI name connection (again, for reasons which I can fully enumerate if necessary), they certainly wouldn't send him to the Marathon one. Why would they? They've already done Marathon. If anything they'd send him to whatever new universe they're formulating. But I still find this to be unlikely, at best, and ludicrous, at worst, once again for reasons which I can enumerate if necessary. Basically, it's just not reasonable to think that the Chief will be part of Bungie's new IP. So this is what it feels like to be a broken record. [Edited on 05.12.2010 3:57 PM PDT]
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    Ibeechu

    Ibeechu

    5/12/2010 11:40:32 PM Permalink
    Spawned: Clearly you've thought about this. But you're still ignoring the fact that Bungie confirmed that Halo and Marathon don't have any connections beyond references here and there. Pixar puts "A113" somewhere in every movie. Does that mean Toy Story takes place in the same Universe as The Incredibles? Look, you can write all you want and try to connect them (by the way, you're assuming a lot of things in your original post). You can cherry pick dozens of sources that seem to suggest they're connected. You could discredit Cortana V and HER sources all you want. You could publish a paper in The Gaming Journal or whatever that strongly implies Halo and Marathon are connected. But all of this is null and void because [i]Bungie confirmed there is no connection[/i]. You're pulling disparate pieces together to support your point when really you don't have a point to make. This is exactly what conspiracy theorists do. Argue with what Bungie said all you want. I'm sure you know more about the fiction than they do. [/rant]
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    Cortana Five

    Cortana Five

    5/12/2010 11:25:04 PM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spawned I read your post, and I have to say. I think you are over-reaching with these swords. They are just popular historical items used in a multitude of games, including Final Fantasy XI. It really comes down to a more simple logic, how do you retain your identity when it belongs to someone else now? Bungie is going to in some way tie these characters together and continue on with their well known and respected hero.[/quote]Understandable, you're not the first to find that thread inconcievable.. But Bungie is no exception when it comes to historical references. Even if my theory isn't true, there are other confirmed connections to mythology and whatnot in Bungie games, including Halo. I think you are sadly mistaken when mentioning Bungie's identity. Yes, Halo was a huge game for Bungie, but that's not the only thing that made the studio great. They [i]can't[/i] continue the chief's story and they [i]can't[/i] continue Marathon's story as it ends when the [url=http://www.marathon.org/story/mifinalscreen.html]universe ends[/url]. Just as the studio decided to put Marathon to rest, they put Halo to rest (although MS may have other plans). Why would they limit their creativity to something that has already been established? Why not start up again with another universe? They've done it with Pathways Into Darkness, Marathon, Myth, Oni, and Halo.
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    ODST27

    ODST27

    5/12/2010 10:54:28 PM Permalink
    I don't get it, why can't people just accept that Halo (Bungie's part in it) and Marathon are both OVER!
  • 0
    Lt Warhead
  • 0
    S034

    S034

    5/12/2010 5:40:42 PM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spawned I read your post, and I have to say. I think you are over-reaching with these swords. They are just popular historical items used in a multitude of games, including Final Fantasy XI. It really comes down to a more simple logic, how do you retain your identity when it belongs to someone else now? Bungie is going to in some way tie these characters together and continue on with their well known and respected hero.[/quote] Why? If they can't openly acknowledge that it's MC, nobody is going to know or likely care. And they can't openly acknowledge it unless they toss something in about it during Reach, which, as I said, would be a pretty big writing stretch, at best. Not only that, Bungie has already DONE Halo and Marathon. Why the hell would they do them again? That just ties their creative hands even tighter, because then they'd have to pay attention to TWO lines of Canon, Halo's and Marathon's. And if you include Pathways into Darkness, THREE lines of canon. Toes would be stepped on, and fans would get pissed. Not only that, even if Bungie managed to pull off a successful merge between the two, 343 can come in THE NEXT DAY and retcon it, because once Reach launches, Bungie is done with Halo and 343 and Microsoft have total control. All they have to do is make one comment about the MC's location and it would completely destroy the merge made by Bungie. 343, whether we like it or not, has full control of the MC now, and if Bungie were to try to merge him 343 could just say it never happened and it would completely destroy the universe that Bungie was trying to create. Bungie's not going to risk the credibility of the plot of their next franchise simply to hold on to the MC. On a related note, why is it that people insist on identifying Bungie only with Halo? There's this really bizarre feeling of existential fear that's been floating around since Bungie announced the split with Microsoft, and I DON'T KNOW WHY! This weird need to figure out ways for Bungie to still keep doing Halo stuff after Reach just points to a lack of faith in Bungie as a studio, like they can't do anything besides Halo. Halo's great. I love it, and I'll probably still love it once it's out of Bungie's hands. But Bungie is BETTER THAN HALO. Halo is [i][b][u]NOT[/u][/b][/i] Bungie's "identity", and their "identity" does not belong to someone else now. Let it go. Bungie doesn't need the Master Chief. Maybe the Master Chief needed Bungie; we'll wait and see what happens with 343 at the reins. But whatever Bungie comes out with once their partnership with Activision goes into high gear, it won't be Halo, and it won't be Marathon. Could there be ambivalent and enigmatic references? Sure. There probably will be. This is Bungie, after all. It's one of the things they're best known for. But Bungie's next game will not have us playing as the Chief. We are headed into uncharted waters with Bungie at the helm. Jump ship now if you want to remain within known territory. [Edited on 05.12.2010 9:42 AM PDT]
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    Spawned

    Spawned

    5/12/2010 8:20:17 AM Permalink
    I read your post, and I have to say. I think you are over-reaching with these swords. They are just popular historical items used in a multitude of games, including Final Fantasy XI. It really comes down to a more simple logic, how do you retain your identity when it belongs to someone else now? Bungie is going to in some way tie these characters together and continue on with their well known and respected hero.
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    S034

    S034

    5/12/2010 6:48:25 AM Permalink
    I think the only way they could pull off an open confirmation without causing major legal problems is if they somehow confirmed it in Reach. And doing so would be a MAJOR stretch in terms of storytelling. God, how I hate writing for convenience....
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    Cortana Five

    Cortana Five

    5/12/2010 6:44:57 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] S_034 Except for the fact that even if your idea is somehow right (which I find highly unlikely, for reasons which i can enumerate if necessary but would prefer not to out of sheer laziness), there's absolutely no way that they could openly acknowledge that it was the Chief. SPARTAN-117 is part of the Halo universe, which, after Reach, Bungie legally can't touch. So they can make subtle hints, but nothing that would constitute confirmation.[/quote]Agreed. Public confirmation of such a thing would likely allow MS to snatch Marathon out of Bungie's hands... Maybe. Perhaps that's why Marathon's trademark was renewed? Independence brings about a lot of reasons to look over one's shoulder. EDIT: I said something about bed earlier, apparently that didn't happen. >_> [Edited on 05.11.2010 10:47 PM PDT]
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    S034

    S034

    5/12/2010 6:42:45 AM Permalink
    Except for the fact that even if your idea is somehow right (which I find highly unlikely, for reasons which i can enumerate if necessary but would prefer not to out of sheer laziness), there's absolutely no way that they could openly acknowledge that it was the Chief. SPARTAN-117 is part of the Halo universe, which, after Reach, Bungie legally can't touch. So they can make subtle hints, but nothing that would constitute confirmation. In short, whether you're right or not doesn't matter, because you won't ever find out. Yay intellectual property laws! [Edited on 05.11.2010 10:45 PM PDT]
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    Cortana Five

    Cortana Five

    5/12/2010 6:32:49 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spawned 3 Halo Main Games, 3 Marathon...1 game to unite them all![/quote]Again, at the risk of appearing rude, there's more to it than that. According to the mythology tied to the swords/AIs, each sword took three years to make. It may be more than one, I don't know. Anyways, it's bedtime. If you want to know more about a possible new Bungie game, check the actual mythology behind it and (here I go again) that darned thread I made.
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    Spawned
  • 0
    Cortana Five

    Cortana Five

    5/12/2010 5:57:29 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spawned I found it odd that in one of the reach ViDoc's a Marathon shirt is being worn. I also find it odd that Bungie has split it's staff while working on what has been described by Activision as a "Halo style shooter."[/quote]Marathon is part of Bungie culture and represents a lot of Bungie's history. They've worn Marathon shirts in other documentaries. "My name is Cortana, of the same steel and temper as Joyeuse and Durandal." If you read my thread, it shows that even if the chief went to the Marathon universe, there would be no continuation of it. Joyeuse would presumably be the next AI as Cortana was the second and Durandal was the first. Halo was a Marathon-style game. Joyeuse's game is a Halo-style. Three in the same. I should have said it earlier, but there's a quote floating around (I'm looking for the original), but it goes kinda like this. There's a painting of several mean who are presumably Bungie staff standing around a dead horse. That horse is the Marathon series. They didn't want to beat Marathon into the ground and I feel that they would rather break the mold, rather than lean on old titles.
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    BrianofNazereth

    BrianofNazereth

    5/12/2010 5:49:37 AM Permalink
    [quote][b]Posted by:[/b] Spawned That Wiki is fan based lore and speculation.[/quote] And the TF Wiki is as well, but it's regarded as basically an official information source. The guys behind these fan wikis REALLY know their stuff, and the creators themselves often contribute.
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
  • 0
    Spawned

    Spawned

    5/12/2010 5:48:38 AM Permalink
    I found it odd that in one of the reach ViDoc's a Marathon shirt is being worn. I also find it odd that Bungie has split it's staff while working on what has been described by Activision as a "Halo style shooter." [Edited on 05.11.2010 9:49 PM PDT]
    Reply Start Related Topic
    Edit Preview Cancel
preload icon
preload icon
preload icon
You are not allowed to view this content.